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would you classify a Blimp on a rope (weather baloon) an "other" jump?

Kinda of a follow up question... If some one had a tethered balloon, would you be willing to pay to jump it?

why pay? just get on before it is let up....

definitely not a BASE... it's from a flying object... unless you climb and jump from the rope... maybe can be considered as a Span ???

but it dosent fly... it floats... there is no flying....

I have done many low jumps from rope spans! Is a parachure required for base jumping? Or can I log all the double dutch I did when I was a kid?

Hello,
A 'tethered balloon' is by definition a 'fixed object',
thus qualifies as a BASE jump, logged as 'other'.
Avery

I concur. The tether is the determining factor. "O"

On a similar note, does anyone have knowledge of (or can anyone point me to) the FAA's jurisdiction over such matters? Is a tethered balloon (of any construction) regulated by the FAA? I suppose if it is over 200' then it would fall under the obstruction marking and lighting requirements, but provided that is covered... what are the rules?

I have a bunch of mylar and an iron...

Gardner

The relevant FAA material is in FAR Part 101.

http://www.access.gpo.gov/..._14/14cfr101_00.html

It talks about Moored Balloons. As far as all my research shows, the FAA does not consider them an aircraft. If they take passengers, then they are governed by individual state amusement ride laws.

Up here in Canada, they are considered an aircraft with many exceptions. I've done a fair bit of research into them over the past year, as my boss has recently purchased one. It was supposed to be operating this summer, (with yours truly doing daily demo jumps from 1000 feet) but logistics with a local municipal governing body put a halt to that. It sits in a warehouse just down the road, taunting me everytime I go by!

Feel free to PM me with any questions you might have, and I'll see what I can tell you.

Maybe by definition...
But in my book it's a SKYDIVE. From ANY altitude.

If the primary characteristic that makes base significantly different from skydiving is the potential for object strike, then this is base. The cable can be struck and it can collapse your canopy. It can kill you.

So it makes no nevermind what anyone calls your jump, but you'd better respect this object with base-like standards of gear, packing, and body position.

(An interesting question is also how high this thing is. If it's 3000' that's more skydive-like. If it's 250', I'm going to laugh at anyone who insists it's a skydive.)

Would anyone be willing to actually pay to jump a balloon if it was able to make multiple climbs to the end of its tether? Like invite one in for a boogie or a gather at someplace like the legal span in the west?

Hello,
If said 'tethered balloon' is firmly 'fixed' @ 400',
and as narcimund pointed out, the rope is an obstacle,
AND i'm jumping a velcro-closed single-canopy rig,
how could I log it in my 'plane' jumper book?
Avery

It seems like we have this "how would I log this..." type thread about twice a year....

If you have to ask what classification it is, then it isn't B, A, S, or E. It's usually an "O" for OTHER.

However, in my opinion, a tethered ballon is a skydive. The ballon is only temporarily fixed to the ground and it is always moving a little bit relative to the ground. If it's always moving, it isn't truly fixed.

The really funny thing is that the old timers always told me a true BASE jump is one where you leave the bridge with a PACKED canopy. This little rule was in place to prevent some yahoo from logging paragliding type cliff exits. That kinda shoots down all those McConkey jumps as being BASE jumps. But I guess times change. What will our amazing little sport surprise us with next?

 

why do you have to?

You can log your dinner in your plane jumper book if you like. Or your sexual exploits. In case you didn't notice, you BOUGHT the thing and you can do anything you like with it.

You can jump off the curb and log it as a skydive. Or as a base jump. It's your book and you can rub poop on the pages if you like. There are no rules because it's your property!

Base jumpers scorn skydivers because they trade their personal initiative for organization and rules. Sometimes even base jumpers do the same thing.

Personally, I log my base jumps in the same book as my skydives. Who's to tell me not to?

Hello,
How about this then:
A Motor Home, traveling at 20mph across the Hogg State Bridge,
the vehicle has a 'pilot', the jumpers on top have to 'spot' the load.
Is that a BASE jump?
And from an engineers perspective:
Spans have 'expansion joints', (no, not KGB at the local 420), to allow
for movement, because a bridge is always moving.
Tall buildings are built to move, so the exit point of the Petronas
is in effect always moving.
Those cheesy little antennas are swaying to and fro.
Ever been on a cliff during an earthquake?
The cable car moves, has a 'pilot', and has to be spotted!
Ever jumped from a tree?
They are moving, UP!
I just love these discussions.
You say tomato, I say tomato.
(Don't be dissin' McConkeys, the huckster will get all worked up.)
I think I'll start a thread on the proper way to fold a pilot chute.
I'm sure leroydb has more questions than answers now......
I love you guys.
Avery

rofl avery, you funny.

Leroy,

Check out the Australian Base Association website at www.basejump.org they have their own "tethered balloon" which they have used for a couple of BASE boogies. I can't remember whic part of the site it's in, but you'll have fun finding it anyway.

Do you log pinrigs and velcrorigs in different logbooks?

Personaly to me a balloon is a balloon and there for not a fixed object,but who cares? do you have fun while jumping this thing?then carry on.

if i jump off a Cessna in low altitude,and i has grass and mudd under my shoes,could i then log it as a Jump from a plane?

Well said Avery!! LMAO

werd to muh homie...

Gardner

reading an old post....

well if you wana get all techy.. a building is designed to sway with the wind, most if not all skyscrapers have counter weights in them. A bridge also moves some what. And to beat it to death... the earth is always moving.... hell and we all know that "A's" move........

dont take this serious... just a random thought

Listen to Me you, you Goofy Basterd.

There is no way in Hell a tethered Blimp is a BASE Object.
I have been in the construction buisness all my life.
It is obvious. it is heald to Earth by only a F##king Rope !

BASE Object have a Foundation or Footing that........
* CONNECTS Them To EARTH *

Bridge - Footing or foundation
Antenna - Foundation and Footings for Guy Wires.
Earth - It is its own Foundation.
Building - Both Footings and Foundations.
Dams (are earth) - Is a Retaining Footing.

Footings and Foundations on these objects usually consist of
Thousands of Yards of Concrete. Hundereds or Thousands of Tons
of weight.
Except for Earth, but cement that makes up the structural strength
of Concrete is made from elements from earth.

Don't Make me go on about this subject ! ... I am Right.

[To be read in a synthesized metallic voice]

The universe is expanding constantly therefore we can not consider even the planet which we call our home to be a fixed object.

For this reason I contend that there is no such thing as a BASE jump and you are all smoking crack...

Professor Stephen HawSkin'

haha, goofy bas*&^? too funny

but being "goofy" allows me to be unique and not part of this cookie cutter society we all call home. That, and, that's why people like me

chill, I wasn't serious man.

wow.. um maybe we can flick sometime if we're in each others area (should be in the Big OR. in dec or jan)

I disagree. A baloon jump, fixed or not, is a skydive.

The definition is a bit murky here... some people i know call low-altitude helicopter jumps "skybase". Then others call McConkey a base jump. Yet others claim 60ft over the water is BASE... Whatever makes you smile, i guess

bsbd!

Yuri.

You could argue, that an 'A' is just a 'B' with no clothes on.

... and not only helicopter jumps The jumps from the balloons, paragliders, handgliders with motors and planes also called "skybase". They think that all the jumps were made with base-purposed gear are "skybase". Even from regular skydive's altitude.
It is just one reason to log the jump as a skydive -- the existence of reserve canopy on your back. And I don't know how may be logged the jump with Sorserer rig.

Gee, I wish Carl Boenish was still alive to lead us out of this . . .

Carl was a very progressive thinker, and if we are to ever figure this out, we should try to carry that progressiveness on.

I know when sneaking in a jump from Basic Research’s tethered (at 600-feet) balloon in the pre-potato days of their FJC, it sure felt like any other BASE jump I had made. I mean, I was wearing BASE gear and the spot where I'd crater, if it all went wrong, wasn’t moving. It just didn’t feel like skydiving, at all.

However, a few years prior, while making skydiving balloon jumps, I did an emergency exit from a balloon, that blew its top on the way to 4000-feet at 1200-feet. I knew, going over the side, that I was skydiving

I personally like to think a BASE jump is anything that’s not a skydive, and that includes rollovers and the like. The new definition of a BASE jump might be something like how the Supreme Court defines pornography. You know it when you see it.

When Phil Smith, BASE 1, jumped from a moving train crossing the Pecos River in Texas in the early 1980s, it was certainly considered a BASE jump, so the “fixed” part has already been a murky concept for years.

You can’t say BASE has to do with low altitude, as there are many (relatively) high ones.

When we tried to get the FAA to grant us a waiver to exit the Otter on a pass down the runway at 500-feet (for air shows) the only reason they even considered it, was we convinced them we weren’t skydiving, we were BASE jumping.

But, that wouldn't square with (green) Jean Boenish's fondness for BASE, because it didn't involve carbon-spewing airplanes.

In the end I like to think Carl would have left it this way - "A BASE jump is a BASE jump. A skydive is a skydive. And I think everyone here already knows the difference."

Nick
BASE 194

wow.. um maybe we can flick sometime if we're in each others area (should be in the Big OR. in Dec. or Jan.)
............................................

Make sure you get a hold of me if you make it out here.
We will for sure do a couple jumps.

I might have gone a little over board, calling you Goofy.but....
I'm sticking to my guns on the Bastard part.

haha *smirk*, ok you old fart

I would pay some, but not more than $15 per jump (that's about what each base jump has cost me when I average all the money I've spent base jumping and when I don't consider gear purchases because that is paid for with plasma). I would jump that balloon every morning if you'd fill it up near my house - and work extra hours for the jump $$. Is it a BASE jump though? NO!!! Balloons/blimps are aircraft - whoever thinks they're connected to the earth doesn't know what the word "grounded" means! I'm with Ray 100%, it's a skydive that you need base gear for. It's still fun.

What about the difference between legal and illegal jumps - I know the bridge during the day is certainly less of a BASE jump than some of the jumps I've made at night!

the first time I read this when you posted it sometime ago, I thought you were joking........... you really did sell your soul for it hey!

any "object" that can fly,hove must be considderet as an non fixed object,if it aint a fixed object it cant be a BASE jump,in doubt log it as a skydive

that easy...

or an "O."

its ur log...

i do the same about Os as i do for B.A.S.E. it has to be an fixed object or i log it as a skydive...

Os are still fixed objects,they just cant be defined clear by B.A.S.E. but if its fixed and you jump it,its still an BASE object.

Wait... so people actually log BASE jumps? Like with a book? Hell, I don't even log skydives. I keep a tally, and that's about it. Well, with as few BASE jumps as I have, they're just committed to memory right now. So, if I was asked to classify a blimp or balloon I'd jumped, I'd just say, "fuck it, I jumped it."

yup i need to keep hold on the #s of slider ups(1 so far) so i one day when i get 100 slider ups can jump some of the legal Bs around the worldbut by the #s right now it looks like ill have 13700BASE jumps before i have 100 slider ups.. so i guess by that time it will be good to point a finger at my jump#29 were i made my sofar only slider up

besides that its really fun to read funny comments after returned back from a trip.. well atleast i think so..

I stopped logging skydives and BASE jumps nearly a year ago. It's kinda nice not knowing how many I have, and not having to compare (or be compared) to anyone else.

but you would like some kind of evidence if an nknown jumper showed up at BD ready to jump by him self.At least you would like to know that the guy can take care about himself right...

what i mean is that you have a name.. evryone knows who you are and alot of what you have done.. noone ever gonna ask you about to prove anything to jump the object...

I can see why you dont log,even as i think ill log all my jumps(atleast BASE)to the fun of it,to give each jump the creidt that makes it posibly to go back and rember THAT jump on a regular work day...

were all different,and have different reassons to do stuff,some people (like me)who really wants to jump some of the fun stuff need to hold track of the info in case ill be asked for it at a given time...

As most know i never went to any big meetings yet,first i like the small group thing,second,i manegede to use all my mony before i can pay such a trip,third most of thouse events claims a slider which im scared about

One day ill visit BD,Moscow and Kurlalumpo(and perhaps even the big walls in LB and Norway) i i dont use all my mony on gadgets and beers

I also stopped logging all my jumps in the early 90s, as just another way to rebel I suppose, but now I really wish I hadn’t done that. When I go back and look at my logbooks it gives me a timeline, both for my life, and for my book. Chasing down dates and names has proven to be the biggest obstacle to finishing my book on BASE jumping. Sometimes those logbook entries from twenty or thirty years ago sparks memories that would be otherwise be lost to time.

I’ve learned the present never seems important enough to document until it is wrapped in the passage of time.

I sat in a hotel banquet room in 1987 as Carl Boenish is awarded the USPA Achievement Award three years after he had died. I sat in the back (it was all skydivers in attendance) with a little red logbook Jean Boenish handed me and I looked at what Carl wrote in his own hand about the BASE jumps he had made. It would have been a real loss if Carl had not recorded that stuff,

And besides, who know what the future holds for any of us? Which one of you will be the historical figures of tomorrow? If some poor schmuck, thirty years from now, is trying to piece together events (the ones you thought weren’t very important at the time) because you added something to the human condition, it does become important.

I designed, published, and sold the first logbook for BASE jumping (BASELog) there ever was, even when I wasn’t logging myself.

Don’t make the same mistake.

Nick
BASE 194

Good point, Nick.

I guess it really depends on the person. I logged my jumps for 11 years and never once went back to read them. If I have to read a logbook to trigger a memory somewhere down the road, then it probably wasn't anything special to remember in the first place.

I just think, as of late, that jumpers are *very* much caught up in the numbers game. I've heard many jumpers say that they're going to the Perrine and they're "going to make 25 jumps". I go to the Perrine not to make X number of jumps, but to have a good time and jump until I'm tired or satisfied. It's not about the numbers to me.

Life's so busy and so full it's easy to forget even some of the memorable jumps! Definitely log them! I need to follow my own advice since I stopped logging a couple years ago. My skydiving logbook finally got filled with base jumps.

In my opinion though, depending on what it is you are doing off said span can make it quite a jump as well. At least in my last few weeks, the jumps I have done from the spud have scared me more than many of the other jumps I have done (night or day). At the same time, the night "A" really has a way of puckering me up good.
Soft Landings

This is so true! Going through old logbooks is a lot of fun, it brings up plenty of warm memories. In fact, logbooks (and videos) seem to be the only recollection of certain especially well-done party trips I still log BASE jumps for this reason, but lost track of skydives a few years ago.

Peeking into somebody else's logbook opens a whole new world of joy

As far as going for the numbers, one of my good friends (currently the best jumper in his field) does not log his jumps specifically to avoid this issue. He has a good memory, though

Numbers are becoming somewhat meaningless anyway since everybody has a different idea about what is or isn't a BASE jump, and counting objects is harder than Florida votes - people will never agree on this one.

bsbd!

Yuri.

any "object" that can fly,hove must be considderet as an non fixed object,if it aint a fixed object it cant be a BASE jump,in doubt log it as a skydive

that easy...

Stay safe
Stefan Faber
*****************************

Dude I Got 16 BASE Jumps from a Blimp.
"I'm Good To GO !"

If you Cabled it down to Earth.
Then Attaching the Cables to, Permanent Footings .
With the intention of, Never Flying the Blimp or Balloon.

It would be a BASE Object.

I was taught to keep an accurate skydiving logbook in 1981. Keeping track of your first 100 jumps was important. Twenty something years later, nobody really looks at your skydiving logbook anymore, unless you ask them to. After logging the first 100, I developed a compulsive habit of logging each and every jump, accurately. It has carried on in my BASE jumps, all jumps accurately logged, haven't missed any. It is very cool to go back through the books occasionally and relive the precious seconds. Hope I'm there to log my last BASE jump.

psst i look at the rope as a part of the Blimp or balloon,no i dont think its a BASE jump,but sure is a fun jump anyway..

its all personal

How about cutting the rope, then holding onto the end. Let the blimp pull you up as you hand-over-hand up the rope. You can bring your iPod so you'll have some good Mission Impossible tunes going.

Damn, this is sounding like fun. How many will this blimp carry?

mate.. did you pack your stuff?its time for you to go home now

ill watch the video of the jumps through...

Hello :)…

In my opinion I would track it as an “Other” type BASE jump… The reason why is because I’m more or less focused on what experience I’m gaining out of the jump than what object it is. For example, if someone were to invent an antigravity aircraft that could hover at 500 feet with no downwash I would rack it up as an “Other” type BASE jump, of course only if I was using a BASE rig and exiting into dead air. The reason I say this is because I look at this type of jumping the same way I look at wind tunnel skydiving, it all applies to the big picture as far as experience. I guess my main three supporting factors to my argument are gear, dead air, and technique. Granted, this would all change if I were to take the same antigravity aircraft and hovered at 13,000 ft and used a skydiving rig. Sure, I would exit into dead air but I would have the luxury of altitude and a reserve (Not to mention RSL and Cypress…). Again, it all comes back to what experience I’m gaining when I try to determine what log book to put my experience in. And if I decide to put it in my BASE log book and it doesn’t obviously fall into one of the four BASE letters, I would classify it as “Other”…

Again this is just my opinion and how I do things for me. If someone were to look at my log book and tell me otherwise, I wouldn’t really care and I wouldn’t change how I do things for them. Bottom line is, just like everything in BASE we need to be doing things based on our own reasoning. Sure, we take the bare principles and apply them to what we are doing; but by no means should we loose sleep at night because we don’t want to log something incorrectly. A log book is simply a tool to help you in the future if need be, not something you live by.

BASE is an individual sport and even when you learn from someone else, ultimately we are responsible for everything we do within the sport. So this carries the burden of being able to make decisions for ourselves. What happens when you are on your next BASE jump and something happens under canopy that you have never heard of, you make a decision and go with it… As long as the person who owns the log book knows why they put what they put in their log book, that’s all that matters. Again, I feel you should make your own decision and just go with it…

:)…

SBCmac (Michael)

Agreed.

Yo !

There is also nothing wrong with logging jumps without actually making them. As long as you imagine a jump vividly, you can record it and boost up your numbers. This is called visualization and is practiced by most competitive athletes in the field.

bsbd!

Yuri.