Basejumper.com - archive

General BASE

Rdutch Mar 14, 2003, 11:03 AM

???? Jumping

Ok the smart ass in me took over. After reading the excellent report from Mexico, I was surprised to see that it was modified. Site naming and the policies involved make sense but this is ridiculous. It was a Legal trip. I think that if we have to be so pampering to the idiots of the world to not name legal sites, just to keep someone that doesnt know better from going there, then maybe we need to change the name, no more B.A.S.E. jumping lets call it ?.?.?.? jumping, come on if you tell someone bridge, antennae, or span they just might be tempted to try one of them. Site naming Illegal sites is a bad idea, but the many legal places and especially events shouldn't be held back, and you can easily do a search to find somewhere to jump. Education is better than restriction. Maybe you could add a (???? jumping is a dangerous sport, attempting to do so without proper training can and most probably will result in death, if you dont die and you get caught at a popular ???? site you will get flogged by your local ???? jumping community) to every legal site post, then that would keep people from doing something stupid. But judging the complexity of organizing a trip to Mexico (Is that saying too much) I dont think some weekend yahoo is going to go there for his first ever ???? Jump. And most probably would be interested in contacting whoever is organizing the trip's and arranging training and equipment for the trip.

This came because I was interested in doing a search of the site's to see if I could find picture's.

blair700 Mar 14, 2003, 11:19 AM

Re: [Rdutch] ???? Jumping

Hey Ray,

How many BASE jumps you have??? How many sites have you worked hard to open, then lost to some skydiving yahoo??? Before you condemn the wishes of the moderator and MOST ALL OF US BASE JUMPING READERS, try looking at it from OUR angle, we love to share sites and info, try PMing anyone of us.....
sorry if this sounds arrogant etc. but you touch a nerve with me, all we are asking for is cooperation, do it our way and the possiblities are endless, do it your way and have fun on solos...and getting all the tar out of your fingernails Wink

Wink

edited: I realize you are talking about not naming LEGAL sites, all I'm saying is respect the wishes of the elders and play the game our way, after all there is a reason Tom A and crew have all those jumps.
Peace,
Blair

Rdutch Mar 14, 2003, 11:57 AM

Re: [blair700] ???? Jumping

I understand the thoughts of Tom A, and agree with him mostly, Just trying to make humour at the over moderating going on.
Its his rules and we all have to live with them, but that doesn't mean we have to be happy about it. He even knew he wouldn't get overall positive response to his moderation of the post, as he mentioned.
I think that some people would actually benifit from site naming sometimes, especially the legal one's. How many people do you think got introduced to ??? jumping by bridge day? Also the ones that did recieved training on gear and saftey, an asset to the sport I think. And I might not have impressive base jumping numbers but I do have number's.

Faber Mar 14, 2003, 12:10 PM

Re: [Rdutch] ???? Jumping

In reply to:

Its his rules and we all have to live with them,

It aint Toms rule.Its good BASE behavior to not name sites.Youll see it anywere else aswell.

In reply to:

he wouldn't get overall positive response to his moderation of the post, as he mentioned

Ofcours he knows,from previus treads on the subject.

About the introduce thing.Theres no need to introduce to BASE,its a dangerus sport,the people who want to jump,can find info if they do a litel reserch.

In reply to:

And I might not have impressive base jumping numbers but I do have number's.

I dont eiter,but then again,ill dont to have to jump from the # ill jump a object instead Tongue

Tongue

TomAiello Mar 14, 2003, 12:21 PM

Re: [Rdutch] ???? Jumping

Here's an excerpt of the PM I sent to the original poster on this subject:

In reply to:

I edited the...thread to remove the site names.

I was worried that, with the large number of skydivers on DZ.com, you could potentially find someone reading it who thought:

"Hmm. Legal? Big Wall? Don't have to fly to Europe? I'll just hop down there and make my first jump there. It's all about the bandit jumps. Screw those Adrenaline Exploits guys and there 'big money' expeditions!"

You get the idea.

Anyway, nice work down there. Maybe I'll get a chance to join one of your trips sometime.

Combining the factors (delicate access, guide required, expensive to do properly, difficult site, high consequences for error) I felt that this site was particularly sensitive.

Sometimes I question my own decisions to edit out site names. This is not one of those times.

Feel free to PM me (or post further here) if you want to discuss my decision to edit the post.

Zennie Mar 14, 2003, 1:21 PM

Re: [TomAiello] ???? Jumping

I'm not trying to be argumentative, but a lot of this site-naming discussion has raised a question for me. And before I ask it I'll add that I recently opened a site, so I have a personal stake in site preservation.

Anyway, my question is this... how many sites have actually been closed/ruined by yahoo skydiver bandit jumpers? A well known illegal E in NPS land was once opened but subsequently closed, but that was due to (among other things) the misbehavior of some idiotic BASE jumpers, not skydivers (as far as I know).

Again, this is an honest question... I'm not trying to be combative or belligerent.

Dd0g Mar 14, 2003, 3:12 PM

Re: [Zennie] ???? Jumping

In reply to:

Anyway, my question is this... how many sites have actually been closed/ruined by yahoo skydiver bandit jumpers? A well known illegal E in NPS land was once opened but subsequently closed, but that was due to (among other things) the misbehavior of some idiotic BASE jumpers, not skydivers (as far as I know).

I'm in a foul mood today, so apologies in advance if I seem ill-tempered.

We nearly lost a S in the PNW due to an idiot skydiver buying a BASE rig, driving to a site named by someone (likely a Seattle jumper spewing about their kewl exploits at the DZ over beers. . . but could also have been an online post), juming, nearly killing himself, making the nightly news on all the channels, making every BASE jumper in the PNW look like complete idiots by association, etc.

Perhaps fortunately, the skydiver in question was not smart enough to find the correct S and jumped a sub-100 foot one instead. So the "real" S wasn't burned properly, though the heat on it (and elsewhere) certainly turned up after this little exploit.

So there's a current, verified, tangible example. Q.E.D.

As to the original poster on this thread, I echo 700's comments. . . lemme guess. . . you are a skydiver with 0 BASE jumps who has never opened an object in your life, and likely never will.

Personaly, I'd not put anything past testosterone-poisoned, yahoo skydivers when it comes to doing stupid things relating to BASE. Some skydivers are convinced that their heroism at the DZ is an automatic ticket to BASE fame and fortune. Their misunderstanding of our sport can cost those of us who actually are jumpers dearly.

Therefore, we all pretty much support policies designed to protect naive skydivers from themselves. . . and protect us from them, as well. The DZ is a great place to go with a big ego, not much knowledge, and desire to impress others. BASE is not.

Peace,

D-d0g
BASE 715
. . . over 20 new objects opened, and counting. . .

ManBird Mar 14, 2003, 5:37 PM

Re: [Dd0g] ???? Jumping

Damn straight. I only have a handful of BASE jumps, and have definitely never opened an object, but I can see the logic in hiding names. Hell, the nearby A sometimes seems on the verge because too many people at SDO know about it.

Zennie Mar 14, 2003, 9:46 PM

Re: [Dd0g] ???? Jumping

In reply to:

So there's a current, verified, tangible example. Q.E.D.

Thanks d-dog, that's the sort of response I was hoping to get. This question had come up in offline discussions we've been having and I was hoping to get some real-life examples.

rgoper Mar 15, 2003, 9:42 AM

Jumping

first, i have no BASE jumps. i'm just a BASE wanna-be. referring to the original post here, changing all of the sites names were an exercise in futility as they can be accessed simply be checking the original poster's "profile" and going to his website. i completely understand why BASE jumpers would oppose a "skydiver" giving up objects, or sites. but my question is this, how would a "skydiver" who don't know jack about BASE do it safely without someone giving up some information? or is it the BASE communities position to be "closed, or cliquish?" again, i'm in question/information mode here, no offense intended. i'm not going to come accross as knowing anything about BASE, because i don't, but i want to learn, and i want to be safe. maybe the "skydivers" who go out and get hurt, or worse yet, killed subsequently revealing a site, or an object could have been prevented by an experienced BASE jumper's supervision. sooner or later as interest in BASE jumping rises even further, someone should "step up" and help the "skydivers" who are so inclined to try their hand at BASE jumping. truth of the matter is BASE gear is not regulated, and can be procured by anyone, and if someone goes to the trouble and $$$ of purchasing gear, we should acknowledge their intention of utilizing the gear for enjoyment. nothing but respect for your community.......

Faber Mar 15, 2003, 10:19 AM

Re: [rgoper] Jumping

In reply to:

someone should "step up" and help the "skydivers" who are so inclined to try their hand at BASE jumping.

I could name some who does this(dont tell name while i dont know if they want it/respect to them).Theres alot of info on the net,you can ask the Qs you want.
Theres FJC different places of the world.
But if any one would start BASE,they should get a mentor,that can help them in practice

kokaneegirl Mar 15, 2003, 11:02 AM

Re: [rgoper] Jumping

but my question is this, how would a "skydiver" who don't know jack about BASE do it safely without someone giving up some information?

http://www.blincmagazine.com/cms/article_283.shtml

http://www.vertigobase.com/html/course.htm

http://www.basicresearch.com/

TomAiello Mar 15, 2003, 11:20 AM

Re: [rgoper] Jumping

In reply to:

...changing all of the sites names were an exercise in futility...

I disagree. Your statement is tantamount to saying "if everyone else is doing something, I ought to do it too."

While you cannot force anyone to do anything, you can do what you think is right, in the areas that you can change. I understand that some people will not share my views on BASE ethics. That does not mean that I ought not to hold those views.

In reply to:

...as interest in BASE jumping rises even further, someone should "step up" and help...

I totally agree. That's why I try to help out with BASE knowledge on sites like this one.

There is a huge difference, though, between helping with BASE technique and equipment, and handing out sites. If you want help learning about BASE, I'll gladly "step up". If you want to learn specific sites, come and jump with me (or any other BASE jumper) in person. We're not against sharing knowledge. We're against putting potential dangerous knowledge into the public domain. The idea is to get people to ask for help. If they need help finding the sites, then they are also going to need help jumping them.

Let me go back and bump up our last discussion about this. Have you read it?

rgoper Mar 15, 2003, 11:54 AM

Jumping

the sites you posted are appreciated. (but that's the first place(s) i went to, long ago) i've done more than a few "virtual jumps" but just as i didn't learn how to "skydive" out of a magazine, or a url, i wouldn't actually buy gear, go to one of these sites, and go BASE jump off of an object somewhere on my own, without proper instruction and coaching. Stephen had an excellent suggestion in the "mentor" idea, which is, in my opinion the only way i would do it. thus bringing us back to my original inquiry, who is willing to step forward and help train new BASE jumpers to insure safe and incident free jumping? or does the BASE community wish to be a "closed society?" the way it is now, with everything, and everyone being so "tight lipped" about everything, it could be said that the BASE community may share in some small part, some responseability for disclosed locations of sites, objects, etc...because of the unwillingness to share, and provide information except in the "forums" where a face cannot be associated with a name. i'm sure we'll all agree some type of training program must be instituted in order to abstain from further injury/incident/death, and subsequent disclosure of locations in the future. again, let me reiterate, i know nothing about BASE jumping except for what i have researched, but what i do know is there must be someone, somewhere, willing to mentor and/or train potential BASE jumpers. let's face it, whether it's a site or an object that you personally don't want disclosed, for good reason i may add, it has the potential to be jumped and or desacrated by an inexperienced and untrained "skydiver" because of the absence of training and regulation in this particular realm of "our" sport. i'm old enough, and wise enough to know that i cannot, and would not even consider purchasing gear for any type of jump associated with BASE, but i do know a few "newbies" to "skydiving" that have been vocal about doing it, and they will buy the gear and do the jumps whether mentored, coached or not. which, by the way, i think is a foolish move. thus my concern. in the end, a solid training program, mentoring, coaching and help with appropriate gear selection and site/object(s) is imperitive for the longevity of this sport, so one shouldn't have a particular problem if someone does go somewhere and get hurt, or worse, it's highly possible that some of these people (referred to by some as "whuffo skydivers") have inquired about gear, site/object selection for skill level and has been shunned away. even in the original topic, the poster's url site is posted, and can be visited by anyone, but does not offer any services for BASE newbies, only "experienced jumpers" how do you get experienced? just my 0.02 USD.

rgoper Mar 15, 2003, 12:07 PM

Re: [TomAiello] Jumping

In reply to:

Have you read it?

just now. you obviously were "bumping" that while i was in composing my response to the urls. i completely understand your thoughts and feelings on this matter, don't get me wrong. i just think it's wrong to cry "foul" when someone does something and has asked for help and was turned away, not that it has ever happened. your offer for instruction and site selection is well recieved. but in my mind there should be a training program instituted at some point in the "learning curve" to BASE jumping. not just what you learned from "joe bob" and in changing the sites names i was referring to, i wouldn't have known the real names of the sites were it not for you post stating you had changed the names of them, this is what prompted me to research further, and culmanated in me going to the poster's website. no website, not an exercise in futility, website = effort wasted.

TomAiello Mar 15, 2003, 1:07 PM

Re: [rgoper] Jumping

In reply to:

...who is willing to step forward and help train new BASE jumpers...

Lots of people. It's not that hard to find a mentor to train you.

The only commercially available training (as distinct from expeditions) is currently the First Jump Courses offered by various manufacturers. However, a few times in the past a very few jumpers have offered more advanced or intermediate courses. While response is generally good, it is a huge amount of work for the offerers, and the risks are quite large.

In reply to:

...to insure safe and incident free jumping?

It is impossible to insure safe and incident free BASE jumping.

In reply to:

...does the BASE community wish to be a "closed society?" the way it is now...

The BASE community is hardly homogeneous. Some parts of it are easy to get into, some parts are harder. It's pretty much like everything else. But it's not that hard to join. Some random dude who likes to climb (but has never made a parachute jump) can decide to become a BASE jumpers, and four years on can find himself in most of the "in" clubs (and even moderating an internet forum on BASE).

In reply to:

i'm sure we'll all agree some type of training program must be instituted...

I'm not sure that we all agree. I know many experienced BASE jumpers who feel that a formalized training program would detract greatly from the value of the sport. Just because something seems obvious to one does not make it the correct answer for all.

In reply to:

...a solid training program, mentoring, coaching and help with appropriate gear selection and site/object(s) is imperitive for the longevity of this sport

I agree. But the sentiment is hardly universal. A solid training program is essential for the longevity of any particular participant. Not as unquestionably essential for the longevity of the sport as a whole.

In reply to:

the poster's url site is posted, and can be visited by anyone, but does not offer any services for BASE newbies...

I don't think that anyone offering BASE gear or services of any kind ought to be required to offer instruction for beginners (or anything else). Some people just sell pilot chutes. Some sell complete rigs. Some offer first jump courses. Some just offer expeditions.

In reply to:

how do you get experienced?

In my opinion, the best way is to find a local mentor, take a first jump course from a major manufacturer, and start jumping at home under the supervision of your experienced mentor. It's not that complex.

There is plenty of instruction available. It's hardly fair to criticize BASE as a closed community inaccessible to outsiders. Many experienced BASE jumpers level the opposite criticisms.

steveo Mar 15, 2003, 1:49 PM

Re: [rgoper] Jumping

if you understood the complexity and danger of BASE jumping mabe you would think different.you said''to insure safe and incident free jumping'' yeah mabe in fantasy land.this base site may be ahead of it's time.and basejumping definitly is'nt for everyone.but the rules on this fourum are for our own good.and yours

rgoper Mar 15, 2003, 2:24 PM

Re: [steveo] Jumping

In reply to:

again, i'm in question/information mode here, no offense intended. i'm not going to come accross as knowing anything about BASE, because i don't, but i want to learn, and i want to be safe

my words earlier. and i have a concise understanding of "newton's law" trust me.

steveo Mar 15, 2003, 3:13 PM

Re: [rgoper] Jumping

BASE jumpers are a quiet crowd.Iam not a BASE jumper yet but I am a s.a.d jumper d being dam dont take the silence as anything but safty perserverence and the will to survive in an unforgiving sport .

motherhucker Mar 15, 2003, 8:10 PM

Re: [Zennie] ???? Jumping

>how many sites have actually been closed/ruined by yahoo skydiver >bandit jumpers?

#50 Christopher Kennedy, December 2,1997
Age: 35
Antenna Jump
Tucson Arizona, USA
Impact
"Christopher is dead when his feet left the tower is what other jumpers said after
this fatality. Using a skydiving rig not modified for BASE, and without any prior
BASE training or experience, he climbed 364-feet up a 450-foot tower and
jumped only to find his bungee controlled collapsible pilot chute didn't work well at
slow airspeeds. A passer-by found Kennedy's body near the tower the next morning.
He had pulled his reserve handle at some point prior to impact. Alcohol may have been
a contributing factor in this fatality."

Does it really matter if any sites have been closed/ruined or not?
I'm all for thinning out the genepool, but not at the expense of a good BASE site.

freeflyguy Mar 15, 2003, 9:39 PM

Re: [motherhucker] ???? Jumping

i don't know where this thread went. But oh well.

If you want to BASE. Quite crying about it being such a clique. It is. So what. Reason being is the guys that do it, and are true to it, don't want to influence anybody into doing it. They know what they are doing, and the risks.

At Kapow, 2 years ago, Only One guy had a couple BASE jumps. Now there is 20 or more. But when the first ones where breaking into it, the guys from up North that are bad ass BASE jumpers and have opened most everything here, wouldn't hardly talk to them. They seemed cliquey. But who cares. They were awesome in that they wouldn't encourage anybody to take it up. If they saw somebody that shouldn't do it, they are plane asses. That is a good thing.

The ones that really wanted to, forced their way into the club, then, they were helped Tremendously by the ones that seemed cliquey. Now, they will give all the advice they can.

It is great they act a bit elitest at first. For crying out loud, you are jumping off a rock, with one parachute. Not normal in any context.

CrazyThomas Mar 15, 2003, 10:11 PM

Re: [rgoper] Jumping

Start BREAKING LAWS! That is the learning curve.
I am sorry to sound harsh, but if you want to be a "law abiding citizen", BASE will not be for you. BASE is not about following the law. "Trespassing" At the least, that is what we are talking about. And I would not like to see you break the law.
I don't BASE jump at night because it is safer. I BASE jump at night because there is MUCH less chance of being seen by authority types.
Sorry dude, but if LAW ABIDING is your game, BASE jumping is NOT.

Later,
Thomas

Faber Mar 15, 2003, 11:31 PM

Re: [CrazyThomas] Jumping

thats not all true Thomas.There are some legal sites around the world.

I have even heard about one/some?who would take a legal BASE#

The biggest shame for me wouldnt be to get caugth,but to burn a site,so the next or i couldnt jump there again,that cant be countet in mony how much damage such a thing would be

rfarris Mar 16, 2003, 6:46 AM

Re: [CrazyThomas] Jumping

This whole thread has taken so many different turns, that I'm not sure I'm commenting on the original topic. But I would like to share how I, and maybe at least one more jumper down here in our little bitty BASE world think. But we've been known to not think like the normal folk from time to time so be warned.
First, I feel your entry into the sport should be a PERSONAL one. Not because you feel pressured from the "cool dudes" that are doing it. Then, if you are really interested in getting into it, it's up to YOU to learn as much as you can about it before you make that jump. Just like you are responsible for your own Skydive, you are also responsible for your own BASE jumping. This can be done several ways already mentioned somewhere in this thread.
Your so called "mentor" will know just from a few minutes of talking with you whether or not you are really the right person to be going off his hard earned object or not. Trust me, you can tell the difference between someone who is just curious, and someone who wants to BASE jump more than anything else in the world.
It's all about the preparation, and your level of dedication that will win you over with another BASE jumper.
And I agree with CrazyThomas, unless you are fortunate enough to travel the BASE circuit and hit all the legal sites at your leizure, if you want to jump, you will break a law here or there. You won't have impressive jump #'s, but you'll be jumping. And you will be very protective of the sites you have worked hard to open and keep open. The curious skydiver that just wants to make one experimental jump off your object to see if BASE is for them, probably wont be on your next load. They have annual festivals in an easterly State for that.

Rod

rgoper Mar 16, 2003, 7:43 AM

Re: [CrazyThomas] Jumping

In reply to:

Sorry dude, but if LAW ABIDING is your game, BASE jumping is NOT

while i'm certainly not the "rebel" you are, i would not jump an illegal site. there are plenty of legal sites. and your hardly one to be giving advice CT. your moniker speaks volumes of your mindset and attitude. and BREAKING LAWS is hardly the ascent at the base of the "learning curve"

Mac266 Deleted Mar 16, 2003, 10:02 AM

Re: Jumping

this all kinda makes me laugh in away! these Americans saying how hard it is to get into BASE - no one will help you - its too much of a clique - count yourselves lucky and stop moaning - in the UK there are not a great deal of BASE jumpers not a great deal of "easy" sites - not a great deal of forthcoming help - but with enough effort and hunger (without going out and just doing it!) you can start to live your dreams. it takes a lot of time and effort - alot of knock backs and times where you never see the light at the end of the tunnel - but if you really want it - you put your head down stop bitching and work hard for it! - you will then find yourself at the exit - wondering why you are there!!! hehehehehehe Crazy

Crazy

just my late sunday tired arsed ramblings!!!!

Blush

Blush

ps) guinea pigs are just as hard to "get into"

Brokeneagle Mar 16, 2003, 10:11 AM

Re: [kokaneegirl] Jumping

Thank you, kokaneegirl- three excellent informational sites- for any who wish to pursue BASE, all are great info sources for BASE newbies--

freakydiver Mar 16, 2003, 11:35 AM

Re: [freeflyguy] ???? Jumping

In reply to:

They seemed cliquey. But who cares. They were awesome in that they wouldn't encourage anybody to take it up. If they saw somebody that shouldn't do it, they are plane asses. That is a good thing.

I am still deep in the "do i really want the associated risk that comes along with being a good, active, safe, level headed BASE jumper". I have not started BASE jumping but have a very strong desire to. I would prefer the sport to be more difficult to break into, meaning, I better damn well be ready for the risks associated to it to spend the amount of time learning and progressing. I would rather my mentor's and friends that I learn from as my time in the sport progresses to rediculously redicule everything I do to my rig, to my exits, to my landings, etc - rather than it be too easy of a sport to get into. This is what I ask of any partner I travel into high avalanche danger areas with, this is what I ask of someone when I'm on rope with them because the risks are HUGE in these types of sports for incorrect decisions. My bottom line point is, the closed-ness one might assume of the participants of BASE jumping is really not that at all, it is a direct benefit to the sport because those with a true desire to be a part of the sport must spend quite a bit of time to learn it correctly and learn ones limits.

rgoper Mar 16, 2003, 12:23 PM

Re: [freakydiver] ???? Jumping

would everybody agree that skydiving is just as, or more dangerous than BASE? i hear a lot of "aw, dude, this is really dangerous stuff here" anytime anyone launches their body off of, or out of anything, it's dangerous, common sense. sure BASE jumping is complex, but it's not "rocket science" neither is sky diving, can't be, i've got over 500 dives without an injury and only one cut-away/reserve ride. i'd say i'm safe.

Mac266 Deleted Mar 16, 2003, 12:36 PM

Re: [rgoper] ???? Jumping

In reply to:

i've got over 500 dives without an injury and only one cut-away/reserve ride. i'd say i'm safe.

Complacency kills!

Faber Mar 16, 2003, 12:44 PM

Re: [rgoper] ???? Jumping

thats the different.In skydive you have a major safemargen,in Base you dont.If you think your safe in BASE,youll better quit,before you die or get serius injuried.
by the way i have 500+skydives 30 BASEjumps and 3injuries,one major(in my leg at the time,from BASE).i have 4 reserve rides.Yes i fell skydive is safe,but BASE aint!!!
http://www.vertical-visions.com/27xrays.htm

http://juliabell.home.att.net/

try have a look at theese sites

Mac266 Deleted Mar 16, 2003, 12:45 PM

Re: [rgoper] Jumping

In reply to:

i would not jump an illegal site

ok............. get back to us on that when you do start base and get a few jumps in!!! Tongue

Tongue

phukq im bored - may have to break out the guinea pigs soon!!!!! skin you got the new shipment in yet!!! - the special ones! the local ones!!! "we will have no trouble here!!!!" I can I cant!!!

Pirate

Pirate

Pirate

Pirate

Pirate

Pirate

Pirate

Mac266 Deleted Mar 16, 2003, 12:51 PM

Re: [Faber] ???? Jumping

In reply to:

500+skydives 30 BASEjumps and 3injuries,one major(in my leg at the time,from BASE).i have 4 reserve rides.

faber your skydiving packing sucks! so there is a reason for your reserve rides!!!! and your arms are SO long that when you flare you hook the toggle under your shoe - so there is a reason for your BASE injury!!!!! - Laugh

Laugh

Laugh

Laugh

Laugh

my advice - get shorter arms (ronnie corbet has a spare set) and dont be tight and pay someone to pack for you!!!

Cya soon back in the air!!!!!!

PS) your g/f given up smoking yet????? Wink

Wink

TomAiello Mar 16, 2003, 12:53 PM

Re: [rgoper] ???? Jumping

In reply to:

...skydiving is just as, or more dangerous than BASE?

Not even close. Skydiving is about an order of magnitude less dangerous than BASE.

Faber Mar 16, 2003, 1:01 PM

Re: [Mac266] ???? Jumping

ha ha ha

Sly

Laugh

Sly

Nope i just want to tjek my gear,like others here around Wink

Wink

when you flare you hook the toggle under your shoe

In reply to:

Sly

Laugh

get shorter arms

Mac266 Deleted Mar 16, 2003, 1:03 PM

Re: [rgoper] ???? Jumping

In reply to:

would everybody agree that skydiving is just as, or more dangerous than BASE? i hear a lot of "aw, dude, this is really dangerous stuff here" anytime anyone launches their body off of, or out of anything, it's dangerous, common sense. sure BASE jumping is complex, but it's not "rocket science" neither is sky diving, can't be, i've got over 500 dives without an injury and only one cut-away/reserve ride. i'd say i'm safe.

well you can spend a weekend skydiving and to be honest generally shut off from the risks you are taking with skydiving - when was the last time you assessed - i mean really assessed the risks you were about to take? Honestly I would say most skydives I do I go into auto pilot and they just happen – you laugh you fall you land!!! Wohoo!!!! - cause you can afford to do that - no disrespect! I do the same thing - Cant say I remember a BASE jump being like that!!! Crazy

Crazy

Blush

Faber Mar 16, 2003, 1:04 PM

Re: [Mac266] Jumping

funny thourgth:
a smokin guinea pig Sly

Sly

Shocked

,im on video if you preform Pirate

Pirate

rgoper Mar 16, 2003, 1:05 PM

Re: [Faber] ???? Jumping

thanks Stephen! cool sites. i think both activities present the equal amount of dangers, albeit different types of dangers. i'm not trying to take anything away from you jumpers. skydiving presents dangers that generally don't exists in base in the form of number of jumpers in the sky at one time, crowed landing areas, canopy traffic, etc...and of course we know all too well the dangers that are associated with base jumping that do not exists in skydiving. there are more fatalities in skydiving each year vs. base, why? because there are more skydives being made. if the same amount of base jumps were being made, would the fatality rate vs. jump numbers be the same, or would they differ? and in my opinion skydiving or base jumping are safe, and should not be anticipated to be.

Faber Mar 16, 2003, 1:07 PM

Re: [Mac266] ???? Jumping

In reply to:

you fall you land!!! Wohoo!!!!

i do that on each time on a BASE,but i say yeehaa instead Tongue

Tongue

Cant say I remember a BASE jump being like that!!!

Mac266 Deleted Mar 16, 2003, 1:16 PM

Re: [rgoper] ???? Jumping

In reply to:

skydiving presents dangers that generally don't exists in base in the form of number of jumpers in the sky at one time, crowed landing areas, canopy traffic, etc

shit man dont think i could handle that danger! i aint skydiving again!!! i did not realise the dangers involved!!!! i am off to grab the nearest guninea pig and grease it up with swarfeega (sp?)

Sly

Sly

PS) i am not an expert and all postings from here onwards should be taken with pinch of salt as red wine is starting to take effect and the guninea pig is now warm from 3 mins in the microwave!!!!

Pirate

Pirate

Faber Mar 16, 2003, 1:18 PM

Re: [rgoper] ???? Jumping

In reply to:

if the same amount of base jumps were being made, would the fatality rate vs. jump numbers be the same, or would they differ

there would be a huge differ.Sorry to say but i think thats becours theres too many smartass.
I dont want to step at anyone(besides Mac),i were one of thouse aswell.I got an injuri from a hook,i had 2 reserverides becours i were a badass that wanted to get back up in the air(sloppy pack job as Mac said Blush

Blush

).That aint alowed in BASE.
I uasaly use 45-60min to pack my BASE gear(yes D-Dog i know its a long time Wink

Wink

),and if im not happy of it,ill pull it out and start all over.You need to know the limit in BASE,as you have to in skydive,but theres a big differens
Im just a newbie in that sport,but already before i started jumping i found out that you cant just jump off a object.

Mac266 Deleted Mar 16, 2003, 1:20 PM

Re: [Faber] ???? Jumping

In reply to:

you fall you land!!! Wohoo!!!!

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

i do that on each time on a BASE,but i say yeehaa instead

cause you want to be a cowboy!!!!!

In reply to:

Cant say I remember a BASE jump being like that!!!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
In Reply To
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

becours your a wimp,you have to open your eyes

thats what your G/f says when i am hiding in your wardrobe!!!! Wink

Wink

Faber Mar 16, 2003, 1:26 PM

Re: [Mac266] ???? Jumping

In reply to:

thats what your G/f says when i am hiding in your wardrobe!!!!

what are you doing in thre?you dont have to hide,you get a chair and beer while you can watch me finish the smokin job Sly

Sly

Mac266 Deleted Mar 16, 2003, 1:37 PM

Re: [Faber] ???? Jumping

In reply to:

In Reply To
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

thats what your G/f says when i am hiding in your wardrobe!!!!

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

what are you doing in thre?you dont have to hide,you get a chair and beer while you can watch me finish the smokin job

ah cool!!! but i have to shut my eyes! i cant watch you touching the woman i love!!!!! Wink

Wink

Wink

Wink

Wink

freakydiver Mar 16, 2003, 2:30 PM

Re: [rgoper] ???? Jumping

In reply to:

would everybody agree that skydiving is just as, or more dangerous than BASE? i hear a lot of "aw, dude, this is really dangerous stuff here" anytime anyone launches their body off of, or out of anything, it's dangerous, common sense. sure BASE jumping is complex, but it's not "rocket science" neither is sky diving, can't be, i've got over 500 dives without an injury and only one cut-away/reserve ride. i'd say i'm safe.

I would completely disagree with this statement. Skydiving is not nearly as dangerous and unforgiving as BASE jumping.

basehoundsam Mar 16, 2003, 2:44 PM

Re: [rgoper] ???? Jumping

I would seriously rethink your views on BASE. It is so much more complicated that skydiving. You must possess perfect subterminal launch skills, canopy flight skills, rigging and packing skills, just to name a few.There is little to no margin for error if you mis-judge or fail to perform in a near perfect manner on most technical jumps. Skydiving and BASE are related, but not even close to the same sports. If you've never seen a jump in person, or gone out to an exit point with someone, you should check it out some time. The span up in the central US is a good place to see. When you walk out on to the span, all you can think about is that this is about the height you normally start your turn into final when skydiving.
With minimal working altitude on may jumps, as well as object strike potential, tight dangerous landing areas with carnage zones on all four sides, remoteness of jump sights,wind gust potential, lack of a reserve(much less the altitude to use one ), add to that the potential bust factor on some sites, the differences clearly make BASE a much much more potentially dangerous sport.
Just my .02

Zennie Mar 16, 2003, 3:08 PM

Re: [rgoper] Jumping

In reply to:

there are plenty of legal sites

If you know of a single legal site in Texas I'd sure like to know where it is, because I haven't been able to find any. Not like that's stopped me from jumping. Tongue

Tongue

I'm in total agreement with Thomas. If you really want to be an active, experienced (and, though I hate to use the word, safe) BASE jumper in the US, you pretty much have to accept that you will need to do the vast majority of your jumps illegally. Knowing that, you also have to accept the very real possibility that you will be arrested or at the very least accosted by landowners or their security.

I can't speak for anyone else, but part of the appeal of BASE for me is the sneaking around. Finding and assessing a site, getting in, making a jump & getting out (hopefully) undetected.

In reply to:

would everybody agree that skydiving is just as, or more dangerous than BASE?

I can't believe I'm actually reading this.

In reply to:

sure BASE jumping is complex, but it's not "rocket science"

Actually in some ways it is. If you read this forum or blinc, you'll find that the discussions are extremely detailed and technical. BASE jumpers, at least the ones I've met and corresponded with, are total gear-heads with a more thorough understanding of equipment and air dynamics than many riggers.

rgoper Mar 16, 2003, 3:25 PM

[Forget About It] Jumping

In reply to:

Knowing that, you also have to accept the very real possibility that you will be arrested or at the very least accosted by landowners or their security

then i won't do it. when i was referring to "legal sites" i didn't mean in texas. as far as BASE jumpers being more "rigger wise" i'm in total agreement. that said, since i'm not willing to participate in an illegal activity, you just witnessed the shortest interest in BASE jumping history. sorry i ever asked now. i know that every single BASE jumper out there is a brain surgeon, and i'm just a cheezy drilling engineer, i drill fricking holes in the ground with gigantic machinery. so there's no possible way i would ever have enough "grey matter" to participate in this facet of "our" sport. c ya, all of you be safe as you can in this very, very dangerous activity.

blair700 Mar 17, 2003, 8:21 AM

Re: [rgoper] [Forget About It] Jumping

Hey Dude!!!

As long as your following the law, please make sure you never skydive through clouds, forget your seatbelt. etc .etc .etc man I can't even believe your a skydiver, you bad ass drilling mofo.....man your kewl.

luv
your
work
troll Shocked

Shocked

rgoper Mar 17, 2003, 8:57 AM

Re: [blair700] [Forget About It] Jumping

post intended to harrass, intimidate, insult or attack will never have any impact here. any time YOU get ready to do some real work, i kindly extend you an invitation to join a drilling team effort. it has a tendency to immediately seperate the men from the boys.

Dd0g Mar 17, 2003, 5:39 PM

Re: [rgoper] [Forget About It] Jumping

In response to Richard's initial concerns about BASE being closed I can only say this. I believe that this varies alot depending on where one is in the U.S., and also internationally.

Here in the Pacific NW there is a deep and long tradition of mentorship of new jumpers. I look at some of our core jumpers from this area and try to imagine how many hundreds of hours they have spend teaching new-ish folks. . . they add up quickly. Financial renumeration for this? Zero.

Frankly, I don't know any experienced jumpers who won't mentor - myself included. Many of the best jumpers in the world are regularly mentoring folks. I know a very few crabby folks who think mentoring is not "cool," but every one of these people is unqualified to mentor in any case.

My first student just received his BASE number. It was my honor to share my knowledge of the sport with someone new. . . as those who taught me shared their knowledge with me. This is far from unusual.

Overall, I think that finding a mentor in BASE is massively easier than, say, finding a V10 boulderer to teach one how to pull hard. A few minutes online, a few emails to folks asking for advice/introductions, and a willingness to invest some time and energy in traveling to a mentor to learn firsthand - at their convenience - is all that's needed.

Please don't take this as a crabby statement, but one place you'll likely not find BASE folks experienced enough to mentor is at the DZ. Current, active BASE folks in general aren't at the DZ hanging out with the skydivers and bragging about their BASE exploits. Well, ok, my mentor was doing just that when I met him but we all know what he's like Shocked

Shocked

If the net-based resources weren't around, then I could see how hooking up with the top tier of jumpers would be hard. However, with so many top jumpers only an email away, I just don't see the difficulty in finding world-class wisdom available for hire dirt cheap ($0).

BASE mentors take huge risks and invest lots of time and energy in teaching their students. Now, having moved from student to mentor, I can see this more clearly. Expecting mentors to somehow read your mind and seek you out is just unreasonable. There's an inherent reciprocity in the mentorship relationship, much the same as in the master/apprentice roles of professional skill groups.

If you want to learn how to be a competent, solid, knowledgeable BASE jumper then find someone who you respect in the sport and begin a dialogue about your potential involvement. If an anti-sociial dog like me can get mentored by the best, then anyone can.

Peace,

D-d0g

ps: CT is an example of what happens when someone gets into BASE with no mentorship. It's been offered to him by many folks, but he spurns it and we all have seen the results. Not pretty.

ManBird Mar 18, 2003, 12:44 AM

Argh

Argh... less words than more.

BASE jumping is not skydiving.

Most experienced BASE jumpers will help you get into the sport, if that's actually what you want.

Not telling you where the nearest A is in the event that you think you can pop your reserve off of it is a way of protecting your ass, the object, and the sport.

ManBird Mar 18, 2003, 1:09 AM

Re: [rgoper] ???? Jumping

In reply to:

i think both activities present the equal amount of dangers, albeit different types of dangers.

If this is really what you think, never BASE jump. BASE is FAR more dangerous than skydiving. RELATIVE deaths and injuries outweigh the same in skydiving many times over. Unless you're one of maybe less than two dozen or so people in the world, you WILL be SERIOUSLY injured or die if you stay in BASE long enough.

Next time you have an off-heading opening on a skydive, or a pilot-chute hesitation, or miss your desired pull altitude by 100 feet, just remember that it could kill you on a BASE jump.

And if you only want to jump legal sites, then you'll never be more than an ASE jumper (well, that's only as far as I got, too, so... er... but none of my jumps were legal), and most likely just a S jumper.

Personally, I realize the risks, and was willing to take them for a little while. When the relationship with my girlfriend started lasting unusually long (and still is), I quit BASE. The reason is that I know that if I continue BASE jumping, it will eventually kill me or put me out of commission for awhile. That is what you have to accept or reject. When you don't have anything to live for but yourself, it's worth it. Skydiving has it's dangers, but you have far less factors and a good chance of making to an age where you have to hang it up.

I'm not trying to be a dick or anything, I'm just trying to emphasize that the risks are far greater in BASE. Even if you are one of the lucky ones that goes on unscathed, accepting that you've sealed your fate with a commitment to BASE is part of the sport. Makes it fun... when you're single... oh, those days...

feelopen Mar 18, 2003, 2:11 PM

Re: [rgoper] Jumping

are you implying that you're a completely law abiding citizen? do you always keep your corvette under the speed limit? i think there is a time and place for every law, as well as one to break them.

In reply to:

there are plenty of legal sites

yes, but think about how many MORE sites there are that are'nt legal. If Montana was the only place that still had no speed limits, would you drive all the way up there just to speed?

cp

rgoper Mar 18, 2003, 2:56 PM

Re: [feelopen] Jumping

In reply to:

are you implying that you're a completely law abiding citizen?

yes, i am making that implication.

In reply to:

do you always keep your corvette under the speed limit? i think there is a time and place for every law, as well as one to break them.

oh, heck no

In reply to:

If Montana was the only place that still had no speed limits, would you drive all the way up there just to speed?

no, i buy laps at texas world speedway for that. and having statue and position in your hometown and surrounding communities helps as well. generally any good law enforcement representative will treat you as you present yourself, you want to be an a-hole, you get treated like an a-hole. you want to be cool, as a general rule, they will as well. for instance, let's say you have a CCL, so you've been at the watering hole with a few buds slamming down a few, but you forgot your piece is with you, you get stopped for, oh, let's say speeding. the officer notices you've had a few, and ask for your identification, you present it, he 29's you and sees you have a CCL asks if you have your weapon with you, and you say yes. now, the next 2 minutes are critical to your freedom. if your a decent law abiding citizen and your not being an a-hole, chances are your going to get a break, but, if you a dick your next stop won't be the twilight zone, you'll have the jailhouse blues.

moral of story: don't be an a-hole.

Dd0g Mar 18, 2003, 4:21 PM

Re: [ManBird] ???? Jumping

ManBird Mar 18, 2003, 6:44 PM

Re: [Dd0g] ???? Jumping

In reply to:

There are more than a few legal Bs out there - probably more so than legal As, actually.

I thought about that today. I couldn't really think of any legal As. Not taking into consideration the legality of the few jumps I've made, I totally forgot, the A I have in was illegal. Whatever. When it comes down to it, illegality of BASE is fucking dumb, especially in the NPS (don't get me started... you can't BASE jump, but you can rock climb, camp in dangerous conditions, etc... WTF?).

I do realize there are legal Bs, but take into consideration the amount and type of experience one would gain from jumping only legal sites from the start, and compare it to what's out there. Some of the technically legal Bs would probably not be made available to this person.

Anywho, good call. You're right. More legal Bs than As.

Dd0g Mar 18, 2003, 11:16 PM

Re: [ManBird] ???? Jumping

In reply to:

I do realize there are legal Bs, but take into consideration the amount and type of experience one would gain from jumping only legal sites from the start, and compare it to what's out there. Some of the technically legal Bs would probably not be made available to this person.

This is likely true in the States - someone doing only legal jumps here would be relagated to Bridge Day, TF, Moab, and some legal BLM/Forest Service jumps. That experience might not be enough to prep for Bs, though probably someone doing alot of slider-down Moab jumping would cross over well to Bs.

However, in Europe there's lots of jumpers who do either all or nearly all legal jumping and have tons of experience and skills. There's just so much legal cliff jumping over there. . . it's difficult to imagine from afar. Folks doing alot of Lauterbrunnen jumping, for example, would be well-prepared for the big Bs in Malaysia.

Ditto South Africa. Some of those cats are doing nearly all legal jumping, and have very deep skill sets in many areas. Then again, they get legal Bs down there quite regularly!

Peace,

D-d0g

Zenister Mar 19, 2003, 10:46 AM

Re: [rgoper] ???? Jumping

In reply to:

would everybody agree that skydiving is just as, or more dangerous than BASE? i hear a lot of "aw, dude, this is really dangerous stuff here"

one could say that skydiving is at least TWICE as safe as BASE. there is no second chance in a BASE jump, and time is rather short when compared to a skydive.

In reply to:

In reply to:

are you implying that you're a completely law abiding citizen?

yes, i am making that implication.

dude you SOOOOOO need to go read the actual laws sometime..if its on the books its a law, even if no longer enforced and most break one inane law or another every day without realizing it. so next time you sneeze in public and dont say excuse me for example just remember your now a criminal...btw way still broke the law in your example the cop just decided not to treat you like a criminal that day.

edit: not to be an ass (as might be assumed since we've disagreed on this subject before) I certainly respect your intention to be a "completely law abiding citizen", and its not my bag, but some of the things that have become laws ludicrous.

i would say its better to attempt to be a concienceous (sp & i'm lazy today) citizen and respect the intent of the law not the actual "written rules"

BASE is another example of exercising individual freedoms in a manner that (ideally) endagers no one else.

Zennie Mar 19, 2003, 11:04 AM

Re: [Zenister] ???? Jumping

In reply to:

BASE is another example of exercising individual freedoms in a manner that (ideally) endagers no one else.

As many jumpers like to say, we are "stealing altitude".

TomAiello Mar 19, 2003, 2:24 PM

Re: [Zennie] ???? Jumping

In reply to:

...we are "stealing altitude".

Borrowing...we're only borrowing it.

I promise to put it all right back where we found it once we're done.

Oh, wait. I bet you meant Stealing Altitude.

Zennie Mar 19, 2003, 5:17 PM

Re: [TomAiello] ???? Jumping

In reply to:

Borrowing...we're only borrowing it.

I stand corrected. Blush

Blush

This is from John Starr....

In reply to:

Did we coin a phrase?

At the risk of sounding a rather trivial horn, I've included the following article on this site. In doing so I merely hope to preserve a record, and perhaps satisfy a curiosity.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

About a year after the film embarked on a nation-wide (and international) film festival circuit, I was amused to read an article about a Florida BASE jumper who, while being arrested for parachuting from a high rise, turned to a reporter on the scene and shouted, "We love stealing altitude!" Prior to that, the only expression I'd heard BASE jumpers use in that manner was "we're just borrowing a little altitude".

Ever since then, I've had a sneaking suspicion about the apparent metamorphosis of our film's title into what is now apparently a stock phrase used to describe outlaw BASE jumping*. Indeed, it does seem likely that its use amongst BASE jumpers is largely the result of our film's initial popularity with that crowd.

Even before the film saw widespread festival release, Fixed Object Journal (a BASE oriented magazine) editor Nick Di Giovanni had published two stories about the making of the film -- including mention of the film's title. Given the magazine's fairly wide circulation at the time (almost exclusively to active BASE jumpers), I suspect that's probably what got the phrase kick-started.

What Nick and everybody else didn't know at the time was the rather ironic story behind the film's title.

Struggling for the ideal film title, Roger and I found little we actually liked. At the time, local BASE jumpers referred to the act of sneaking onto a skyscraper for a jump as "borrowing altitude". We considered that expression, but decided it was too tame. So we tried "stealing altitude" and immediately loved it.

Ironically, our film's main character absolutely hated it. He felt it was misleading.

"I'm not stealing anything!" he said, before invoking the famous hiker's idiom "take only pictures, leave only footprints" that BASE jumpers were fond of. He was proud of his otherwise low-impact sport (no pun intended), and fiercely opposed our choice of a title.

Considering the significant sacrifices this man was making for our film, I felt we owed him a debt of gratitude. Soon, I was arguing his case to Roger. But Roger wisely refused to budge, and when I could think of no better title I gladly gave in.

So did our film coin the phrase? Possibly. So far I've not been able to find any pre-movie use of the expression in newspaper and magazine articles. I suppose the real question is this: "who cares?"

- John Starr

* Most recently, a front-page story in the Los Angeles Times said BASE jumpers referred to the act of making illegal BASE jumps as "stealing altitude".

Zenister Mar 19, 2003, 8:47 PM

Re: [Zennie] ???? Jumping

nice. thanks for posting that..

i dont think its possible to steal something that (theortically) can never run out.

julesUK Mar 20, 2003, 10:52 AM

Re: [TomAiello] ???? Jumping

In reply to:

...we are "stealing altitude".

Borrowing...we're only borrowing it.

its just 'trespass with intent to leave' - its not really a crime at all.....

Jules

Faber Mar 22, 2003, 7:26 AM

Re: [TomAiello] ???? Jumping

In reply to:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
In Reply To
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

...we are "stealing altitude".

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Borrowing...we're only borrowing it.

Hell no Tom... im felling like Robin Hood,the objects have alot of it,i steal it to give it to the poor once,however im still poor so i havnt gone further Wink

Wink

skypuppy Mar 25, 2003, 8:27 AM

Re: [rgoper] Jumping

A guy I exchanged emails with not too long ago told me he'd made 120 BASE jumps in the last 2 years, with only about 3 being from illegal objects, so if you've got the money and you're willing to travel, it can be done legally... You may not get the whole word, but you can certainly get cliffs and spans...

misterhand Apr 4, 2003, 1:22 PM

Re: [Dd0g] ???? Jumping

hi. before i say anything more....im one of those yahoo skydivers you have such dripping contempt for so you might just want to ignore me. but i would like to ask something....correct me if im wrong but werent all base jumpers once skydivers? wouldnt anyone WITHOUT rock solid freefall/exit/canopy skills going off and base jumping be regarded as a total idiot, a fatality waiting to happen, assuming he survives first attempt? so whats with the contempt? so there are some idiots out there. by the standards you seem to expect people to already know and respect wouldnt the first base jumpers be regarded as fools as well? jumping improvised/modified gear with no base-specific training? taking their reserves off a neighborhood antenna? 99% of the skydivers ive met so far where BASE was discussed were mostly going off about how much more they need to learn before trying BASE. personally someday (at least a couple years from now i think) i myself WILL BASE jump...but not until ive spent months learning from the local base freaks, and have decent BASE gear AND not until i feel my freefall/exit/canopy skills are up to par, AND not until other skydive/BASE jumpers agree with my self-evaluation. a few BASE jumpers ive skydived with have told me when i'm ready, after racking up a few hundred, if i want, ill be taken and schooled and shown how to do it right, and where. by the time i get there i will already have sucked up gigabytes of info on what i'm getting into. ive already started. i'm patient. ive already spent weeks reading everything here, at blinc, elsewhere. asking questions. im not bothering to try to find out where to BASE yet...when i'm ready, the information will become available. the question is, will i want to be around other base jumpers if theyre all that contemptuous of anything that isnt themselves or part of their clique?

motherhucker Apr 4, 2003, 3:27 PM

Re: [misterhand] ???? Jumping

In reply to:

werent all base jumpers once skydivers?

Short answer: No. Quite a few BASE jumpers have skipped the skydiving step and came out just fine. Others have not.

In reply to:

wouldnt anyone WITHOUT rock solid freefall/exit/canopy skills going off and base jumping be regarded as a total idiot, a fatality waiting to happen, assuming he survives first attempt?

In all honesty, it depends on the person. For most people, yes. Every now and again though, you find someone who was born to BASE jump. They are Uber coordinated and naturally have the mechanics nailed. With the right mentoring, these people can be moulded into safe, talented BASE jumpers, without skydiving.
On the other hand, there are MANY skydivers (and BASE jumpers, for that matter) who Aren't Uber coordinated, and Aren't natural BASE jumpers, and ARE bone-breakingly bad jumpers.

In reply to:

so whats with the contempt?

BASE is gaining in popularity and exposure more and more every day. Until a few years ago there were barely over 400 BASE numbers given out. I wouldn't be surprised to see them break 1000 this year. With this kind of rapid growth, the idiots you speak of risk more than just their own life and limbs, they potentially compromise the future of BASE for EVERYBODY when their stupidity calls for outside intervention--ie: legal, medical, civil, or otherwise.

So you could understand that BASE jumpers almost HAVE to be cautious about WHO gets into the sport--and try to TEACH the idiots who refuse to bowl how to do it the right way. I'm glad to see you are waiting until you feel comfortable before taking up BASE jumping--I wish more people did that.

...and to answer your question:

In reply to:

will i want to be around other base jumpers...or part of their clique?

Negative. BASE jumpers are the biggest group of egomanical, self-centered testosterone-pumped bastards the planet has ever seen. I strongly suggest not associating with ANY of these homos (especially the Australians). If you do decide you want to jump, and nobody in the BASE world (or any other world) wants to jump with you, there is a place for you...It's known as the "Mince Division." They'll take you in as one of their own...and braid your hair as you sit around the fireplace and sip wine coolers.
Wink

Wink

(actually, they're right cool blokes--but they wouldn't give me a number Frown

Frown

)

PerFlare Apr 4, 2003, 6:00 PM

Re: [Rdutch] ???? Jumping

Rduch,

This is a answer for the third post in this thread …

BASE jumping is not about rules … and not about breaking existing rules either … most of us just like to jump, and when you jump some (please forgive me for my bad English, I’m a Swede and English are not my mother language) “best practice” are in order, one of them are not to talk about sites in public. Whit public I mean, talk with skydivers and telling them about sites. I do believe that if you really like to BASE jump … so fine, get you self a mentor and learn from him/her. Usually it takes some work to get a base jumper to invest all the time and the effort to help you getting in to the world of base jumping … but when you are in you get to met great people. And sometimes even grand people.

We play a game, the stakes in this game are our lives … it’s like rolling the dice, and as you and I know the house always wins … and sometimes when one of your brothers pay the ultimate price you think of what you can have done to make base jumping a safer place … one thing among others are not to mention sites …

I do have the privilege of meeting both Tom and Dd0g (who post allot in this forum) and I have allot of respect for both of them, I think of them like their was my brothers. Please take their advice … please …

I can’t tell you what to do … but I can ask you to please reconsider

PerFlare

Dd0g Apr 4, 2003, 8:15 PM

Re: [misterhand] ???? Jumping

I'll certainly agree that the poineers of BASE were fools. . . or worse. It took a special kind of madness to do what they did - with the gear they had available to them at the time. I ave upmost respect for those early BASE folks who truly pioneered our sport and helped to set the foundation for what it is today. Honestly, however, calling them "foolish" is probably not inacurate. . . nor insulting, really.

It sounds like your approach to BASE is spot-on. Sadly, there's lots of folks out there who don't share your balanced approach to the sport - it is those ego-driven types that I derisively referred to as "skydivers," which of course is both unfair and mean on my part. Hey, I never claimed to be either nice or fair Crazy

Crazy

As MH says, the skillsets and inherent proclivities that make a safe and "solid" BASE jumper aren't 100% correlated with skydiving skills. Surviving in BASE today, even with the relatively good gear we have nowadays, takes some instincts that just aren't really necessary at the DZ. Heck, there's more than a few folks out there doing BASE jumps that lack the insincts, as well.

Oh, and do watch out for the Aussies. . . everyone knows they can't be trusted. I hear that several of them decided it'd be cool to go gay, but it turns out they couldn't find a single gay guy willing to date them! Not to name names <cough>Feral<cough> Laugh

Laugh

And the Swedes? Well, they are in a class by themselves - what more can be said?

Peace,

D-d0g

hookitt Apr 4, 2003, 10:14 PM

Re: [misterhand ] ???? Jumping

Faber Apr 4, 2003, 11:48 PM

Re: [hookitt] ???? Jumping

CrazyThomas Apr 5, 2003, 8:18 PM

Re: [Faber] ???? Jumping

fuck injuries......let;s just all do a solo jump. No ground crew...no notification of where we are going.
Who has the titanium to do a SOLO jump?
See what being alone truly means.
Peace,
Thomas

Faber Apr 5, 2003, 11:40 PM

Re: [CrazyThomas] ???? Jumping

In reply to:

See what being alone truly means

Bwaaa...I only fell lonly when im forced to mastrubate,in stead of doing my smoking gf Tongue

Tongue

Wink