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Wingsuit flying looks like a hell of a lot of fun, but a lot of the guys doing it are never going to be grandads.

I really dont have any idea what you mean. Care to quantify your statement? What does wingsuiting have to do with one's offspring having children? Do you mean that some of the women who wingsuit will be grandads?
Do you mean that there is a disparity between the chance to be a grandad if a guy wingsuits or not?
What do grandkids have to do with it any way?

Thanks and take care,
space

Gerry,

I've moved your post to the General forum.

Incidents is for discussion of specific incidents.

Thanks.

as long as you stay on the edge, it is not an incident

Obviously he knows the deceased or could even be the father
Of the latest newzealander fatality , judging by the post there seems to be a feeling loss ,

I understand the point he is making

And he is right in the sense of words he uses

But too the originator of the thread basejumpers know they could die basejumping and yes it does seem since 2004 you have a greater chance of dying flying a wingsuit or as I call it (the sleeping bag of death)

Most jumpers ignore the fact and take the approach it won't happen to me , we all do it only the ones that have seen there friends die in front of them actually get it ,

So yes I do understand your post And I am sorry for your loss

It is a shame

R.i.p to the latest 2 wingsuiters


The sad thing is there is gonna be plenty of more contenders
Let's just hope they don't die because of the same mistakes that others have made.

This is BASE. All involved at that level of flying know the risks. If you want to be a grandfather one day, find a new hobby. I find your post, in the wrong forum, annoying & disrespectful.

Really?

OP, sorry for your loss, whatever the relation. I once heard an interview with the mother of a famous skier/BASE jumper who said, "there is no comfort in knowing that someone died doing what they loved, what is comforting is knowing that they truly lived."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FMEe7JqBgvg

His loss is not apparent via his profile. I still fail to see any connection with grandkids. I really fail to imagine George (RIP) or any 20yr old standing on the exit point contemplating the grandkids as a factor of whether to jump or not. Maybe I am taking things to literal. It could be that his goal in life and his proposed goal for all other guys is to be a granddad. Or maybe wait until one is a granddad before wingsuiting. I asked him to clarify what he means.
If I follow the presented logic of the OP then 'wingsuiting' = not being a grand dad the same as skating is = not being a cousin.
I sincerely hope he isnt being condescending.
Take care,
Space

I don't know the OP or his relation to the deceased
but yes Space, I think you're taking him too literally.

The word DECISION comes from Latin meaning to
cut off all other choices, sacrifice is part of the
game. Olympic athletes give up a lot of time and
freedom to become the best at what they do. Just
as parents give up a lot to properly raise their kids.
Douggs mentioned in his book things he has/d to
give up to pursue his dreams.

Paraphrasing Bill Booth's waiver video:

By making this tandem skydive you are accepting
the risks of death or injury in exchange for the
exhilaration of jumping out of an airplane.

Each BASE jumper makes this same trade-off
before every potential jump. I use potential
because the times when she/he climbed down
or decided not to throw the triple gainer, etc.
are times when they decided not to trade the
thrill for the risk due to conditions, LZ, winds,
or just "not feeling it" that moment.


The wife and I are not having kids so as to not
spread the demon ginger seed bwahahaha so
being a grandfather is damn near impossible
for me, but for another man that might be an
important goal, hence he should probably NOT
do a lot of things... meth, BASE, fast food, etc.


I coined the term "Sleeping Bag of Death" (SBD),
do not plan to BASE jump a wingsuit, and believe
if more jumpers used the term SBD like Patto and
I do then maybe some newbies would think twice
before donning a large piece of nylon that restricts
their movements, is unforgiving of mistakes, and
decreases their chances of surviving the jump.

I wish I would have read this post before I posted my previous comment. I was a little drunk & I guess a bit impulsive. I am sorry to anyone who lost someone recently.

Respectfully

Dave

gerryNZ's Profile:

Personal Profile

Email: No email entered.
Interests: Not a base jumper but started skydiving in the early 70s on old surplus army gear. Last jump on a 90 sq' rag, so cool. Many times dreamed of wingsuit flying. Luv what you guys are doing now.
Country: New Zealand
=================================

take care,
space

Re tandem waiver:

"By making this tandem skydive you are accepting the risks of death or injury in exchange for the exhilaration of jumping out of an airplane. "

Legal reasoning only. Surely, most people will convince themselves it will not happen to them. For me, the key issue is really acknowledging you just might die.

Thank you Tom

Just to clarify:
I have no connection with the deceased what so ever.

My origonal post was just a reaction to losing three Kiwis (NZ Nationals) in the last year.

Take care & be careful, base jumping & wingsuit flying looks like one hell of a lota fun.

I think this is an interesting statement. I've been jumping off of stuff for about 12 years now, and it has been, as much as anything, a journey of working out exactly what it is to live.

I do want to live to a ripe old age. I'd love to grow old with my brother and share many new experiences. But that's the tricky part right there--I want to live a full life, but also a long one, and sometimes those two goals are at odds.

I don't think there is a simple black-and-white answer to this one. It's not as easy as, "If you want to live a full life, then forget about living a long one," or vice versa. I think we all make choices (whether we know it or not) about where we sit on the spectrum.

So... I think it's possible to want to be a grandfather one day, and at the same time try to balance that desire against the desire to fall from fixed objects.

Michael

I was speaking from the perspective of acceptance. Everyone wants to live to a ripe old age, but I think to be at the level of flying pushing the limits of our sport, One must accept that living that long may not happen. I personally have been on the fence with jumping & have not jumped in almost a year. I have had some wonderful experiences & a few close ones. I am lucky enough to have not been seriously injured, but I know it is only a matter of time & thats what deters me.

I had a very close call, was sure i was going in. I could see my shadow close up on the talus and my pc was not yet at bridle stretch. I remeber thinking 'this is it, this is what it looks like' and being supprised. Made me realise that despite thinking moments before that I fully accepted the risks, when actually faced with the reality I was only really prepared to accept the outcomes where I survive, and not the one where I die.
I think accepting a risk that things may go wrong is not the same as being prepared to accept death. I quit jumping when I realised this, I don't think there are many jumpers that fully accept the risks for what they truly are.

I don't think there are many jumpers that
fully accept the risks for what they truly are.

Depends on the person for sure but I think
these variables affect the level of awareness:

age

experience

time in sport

number of dead friends

number of paralyzed friends

watching a fatality first hand

So yes, a 20 year old male full of piss and
potential with 93 SKY jumps and 8 BASE
jumps does not probably REALLY know
how much risk he had bitten off or how
much chewing it might take to swallow it.

I saw an interesting number recently. If we didn't die from disease, the average person would live to be something like 2800 years old. Still, the average lifespan for a human being is closer to 80 years old--not because of the things we do, but because we are wildly more likely to die from disease than from accident.

Now, I'm not one of these people who are foolish enough to believe that BASE jumping is as safe as crossing the street. However, I do think the number above underscores the extreme level of safety that the average person lives with. As a society, we are generally pretty shocked when someone dies in a car crash, falling off a ladder, etc. We're somewhat less shocked when someone dies from heart attack, cancer, etc.

It's particularly shocking when someone dies doing something that was completely "optional" like BASE jumping.

But I think, at the end of the day, what we need to remember is that living to old age was never a choice we could make. By and large, the most likely thing to kill you, even if you're a BASE jumper, is disease--something you have very little control over. In my mind, the question isn't so much how long do you want to live--any control we may think we have over that figure is largely illusory--but rather how do you want to live while you're here.

Michael

+1

~ Chris

damn Michael... i knew there was a reason i liked you.

eloquently stated.

Very well said. For many weeks before my first jump this past May, I contemplated my reasons for being compelled to jump (and attempted to weigh them against the risks). I'm not a prodigy. I'm not indestructible. And I've got stuff to lose. So why? The reality, as you so eloquently stated, is that the ultimate risk of BASE can't actually be calculated. Death comes to us all and we don't know when. So death isn't the risk. It's loss of time. If I die on my plane ride back from my FJC (in one week), what did I risk by jumping? A few days or hours of extra time? If, on the other hand, I die jumping during the FJC, people might say that I wasted so much remaining life. But that response assumes that I have so much life left. And to assume that is one of the worst and most arrogant assumptions that anyone can make....yet almost everyone does it every day.

I'm at peace with the fact that I can't know the risk because I can't predict the future. I'll hope and plan as if I'll live forever, but I'll actually live as if this is my last day...because it just might be.

I look forward to meeting a lot of you sickos at BD.