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This aimed more at jumpers who have some time in the sport and may or may not have developed a taste for a certain kind of PC.

I have recently talked about different pilot chute designs with my jumping friends and I would like to know how people here feel about this. I personally have and jump PC's from Apex, Morpheus and Atair/AdrenalinBase. For example:
- I really like the disc handle on my non-vented Morpheus 42
- I have used my Atair/AdrenalinBase 46 for nearly all my handheld jumps and I'm not sure if the tiny vents on it make any difference.
- My Apex 36 has an outside PVC handle that I've duct-taped shut (so to not stick a finger in it at pull time)
- A friend of mine won't jump anything but Morpheus PC's, he finds them superior to other designs
- Another friend sold all her Atair/AdrenalinBase PC's because she was told that they are no good
- Why don't all PC makers even offer the fool-proof single attachment point that a few do?
- Some people say the Asylum Toxic is the best thing ever but still jump other PC's because they think its benefits are not worth the double price.
- How many load tapes is enough for a given size?
- F111 or ZP? Why? For what size is F111 better?
- Vented or not? What size PC's benefit from vents, if any?

What do you jump and why? Do you jump that PC because thats the way you've always done it, or why do you prefer it? Do you happily mix it up like I do or are you in love with just a certain design?

Any good stories? Like that one guy at BridgeDay whose PC separated after his canopy opened. I think the single attachment point thingy would make this impossible while also making the issue of "asymmetric connection from bridle to PC" (poorly explained) go away completely?

Anything goes, let's just ramble about PC's, I'm sick at home and need the entertainment!

Kerkko
BASE1184

I'm pretty new to BASE but my work horse is still an 8 year old, 42", capped, non-vented, zp, 4 load tapes, multi-atachment, pilot from Vertigo. :) It's worked 100% of the time so far. Have thought alot about getting a Badseed or Morpheus when it's time to replace this one, but honestly, I'm not sure that picking fancy colors is worth the extra $100. I've never had any visible hesitation or crazy oscillation. I've jumped varied brands in other sizes, but for my main go-to pilot, if it aint broke...blah blah blah.

This is a big post but I'm home bored too, so here we go.

I hate discs on my PCs and avoid them all together.

My go to is my Apex 48. I have used it from 170ft free fall to 240 Stowed all the way to 3 seconds. Even did a slider off out of a crazy flying contraption with it.

I used to use an Apex 36 but upsized to a 38 for that delay range. I jump a Troll 285 so like the extra pulling power. I also prefer large mesh on all my PCs now too.

Early on I ended up with a full set of Morpheus PCs. I don't know how they passed QC but these things were absolute garbage. None of the load tapes on the ZP and the mesh even lined up. So I got rid of those and just haven't gone back for more. I also mentioned I don't like discs on my PCs and think that the Morpheus PCs with 8 load tapes, a disc and a plastic handle are total overkill.

Not sure of their quality as I don't buy them cos they cost too much once you convert the euro over.

Because it isn't necessary. How fool proof does a PC really need to be?

I'm one of these people. I did buy one just to check it out. It's a pretty little thing too.

None. They are there to make you feel safe

No experience here. I have always used ZP PCs.

I think that the 42 and the 38/36 benefit the most from venting because this is where you have significant airspeed to cause oscillations but are still pretty close to the object. I don't believe low go and throws with a 48 would be prone to oscillating and it doesn't really matter with a 32 because you should be well away from the object by then.

I have jumped PCs from Morpheus, Apex, BR, Vertigo, Asylum and Atair and have found over the years my kit now has mostly Apex PCs. Decent price and they do the job.

I bought a Toxic to check it out. Loaned it to a friend who decided on being PCA'd instead and ended up tearing my brand new (less than 20 jumps) Toxic in half That was the last time I bought some thing fancy.

Im not really a fan of the end cap either. I really like asylums pilot chutes. The toxic is the best feeling no handle pilot chute I have ever used, though it certainly is more expensive. I use an internal handle 38 for wingsuit, a 36 f111 external for terminal stuff. I also recommend the single point attachment. Just a little extra warm fuzzy that some may think is unneccesary, but why not?

If you guys come to visit and jump moab, ill bring a slew of pilot chutes for you to try from asylum.

Bad seed.

a good pitch

Absolutely. A shitty pitch with a Toxic will burn you in much faster than a good pitch with a shitty old Gravity Sports PC that oscillates like hell.

But I have Toxics up to 42, then a non-vented Asylum 48 for the low stuff.

Any Brand PC, I think the most important things are:
1. Understanding WHY you should use the size you are using with YOUR particular gear setup, and going larger when in doubt. Don't listen to the guy with a 12lb canopy telling you that he has always used a 38 inch PC on low stuff if you are jumping a 25lb canopy. Understand. Don't be a sheep.
2. Pitching like your life depends on it. I watched some people jump this weekend who have been coached to "place the PC" and they scared the hell out of me. Pitch it like you have picked up a poisonous snake.

But YMMV.

I like it!

 
Hokay, so far: 43 votes and from this outtake 40% prefer Asylum product. I'm guessing they are voting for the Toxic mainly? Apex, Morpheus and Atair/AdrenalinBase share the rest of the podium. I know there has to be more great stories about PC's than the few we've heard so let them all out, please! (I'm still sick and UKmarkJ isn't really doing it for me)

More Q's: When do you retire a PC?

My take is that the PC is probably the most important part of the system. And other than a dedicated staticline PC I will rather retire one early than wait for it to tear on a jump. I'm guessing most PC's are eventually retired because of damage sustained rather after a jump than during one.

I've yet to retire a single one of mine.

Fledgling and Charley, why don't you like the disc handle?

And Charley I will absolutely let you know when I'm coming over. Might not be next year, but I'll be there at some point.

Kerkko
BASE1184

Have not jumped a Toxic yet, but most others Yes.

I tore the mesh on a PC during a static line jump.
Repaired the mesh by hand with some thread and
now use it as my dedicated S/L PC on a bridle I
modified with a loop in the middle.

I can get my non-disc PCs packed neater/nicer
for stowed jumps... but since 2/3 of my jumps
are low hand held and static line jumps it might
just be a lack of practice.

I thought the tapes help the PC retain its shape
during the deployment process when there is
a tendency for it to elongate.

I have had two pilot chute hesitations:

A) From 300 feet, handheld, go & throw, in a
strong tail wind with a 42" vented by Asylum.
Probably would have been better to take one
second to build up some air speed before I
threw the PC into the next county.

B) From 315 feet, handheld, 1 second delay,
in a light tail wind with a 48" non-vented PC.
Not 100% sure of the manufacturer since I
bought it from Paul/VID666 but it looks just
like my big Morpheus sky anchors.

Cause that time might been a sweaty hand
and being completely S-folding for a touch
longer than usual. Or random bad luck.

Any way the very short canopy flight, tree
landing & gear recovery was interesting

I've had many over the years... but mainly I jump Apex and Asylum. I really like the quality and feel of Marty's PCs, but have also acquired many Apex PCs because I was just buying them from Jimmy and Marta when I'd run into them. It just so happens they've all worked great for me for many jumps and I see no reason that they won't keep on working great.

Ultimately, I just like a PC that is round. I've jumped some real POS PCs and they worked just fine as well, but the fact is that it is probably the single most important piece of gear you own.

I also dislike caps or handles of any kind, except on a 36 or smaller, but even then, I don't think they're necessary. Myself, and most people I see, pack the PC with a pretty huge 'nug' hanging out of the BOC, so what's the point?

I will use pretty much anything that's symmetrically built and has load tapes, but I do have a few preferences.

I like larger (46/48) PCs to be F111. It makes them a shitload easier to stow, and saves from the unnecessary BOC stretching. Although when you are holding a mushroom in your hand the ZP PC definitely feels "better", but I know both work fine (you know, field tested :)

I have a number of 42" PCs, but I really like my no handle Asylum 42" with vented apex. But I also like my 42" Apex with vented apex and PVC handle. I DO NOT like the Morpheus vented 42" because it has the regular size cordura disc, and is vented around it, thus it doesn't really have apex vents, but rather vents around the apex.

I prefer to have PVC handles (taped) on my 38/36/32 and for them to be vented at the Apex. I have a collection of Apex/BR/Asylum PCs that work just fine.

I have 3 Adrenaline/Atair PCs and they seem 100% good and fine, but the one vented one seems to have much smaller apex vent than any other manufacturer I have seen. No opinion though, as I have not had a chance to jump it.

I guess the bottom line is that I have never liked the cordura disc handle, as it makes no sense. Just like blitzkrieg when I pack my no handle PCs I pack with enough bulk at the apex where that's what I am grabbing. A cordura handle actually takes away from that.

in short :

large PCs : F111
all freefall PCs : vented
all PCs under 42" : with taped PVC handles
no disc handles

I really like the bad seed single attachment point, although i haven't yet tried one myself. Planning on buying 48 and 38 vented, both zp. Any opinions on bad seed?
One thing i noticed is that morpheus' pcs have 8 load tapes while bad seed has 6. Does it make any difference?

Totally agree with the cap and nug assessment. Just doesn't feel right in my hand vs a nice nug of mesh and pilot chute innards.

Unlike most people I don't like a big hunk of PC hanging out of my BOC, I think it's sloppy and serves no real purpose. I prefer to keep it small but densely packed to provide a good solid hand hold. Just found I can't do this as well with a cap on there. Seems like the cap even favours the big hunk hanging from the BOC pack style.

This would actually put the vents closer to the highest point of pressure therefore making them more beneficial ie. the entire Toxic series.

It seems that a lot of people are preferring vented PC's. Personally I have never been that convinced about the practical effect of the venting in PC. The theory makes sense but how is the effect in practise? I have seen a lot of vented PC's that oscillate (I for example own one and don't jump it for this specific reason) and non vented PC's that don't and therefore have come to a conclusion that the construction and proper size of the PC is far more important than venting. I at the moment jump almost all the time non vented ZP PC's and have not noticed any negative effect on my openings.

For those who swear to the name of vented PC's, why don't you then go for F-111 PC? From my point of view that would be the "ultimate" venting solution since then the whole PC is "leaking out" excess air through the whole fabric and not only through apex vent. Also what is the reason you prefer vented PC's? Is it because somebody told you so or have you noticed yourself noticeable impact on you openings by switching to a vented PC? For example you have video footage of yourself doing multiple 7s delays with nonvented ZP 38 and it oscillates as hell where as after you changed into AV 38 from same manufacturer there is no oscillation at all and you heading performance also increased dramatically?

Not posting at you. I just build my own. Stane from Atair took my orbiter pc (I didnt build it) and gave me a vented . The pc was not an orbiter in the beginning. I like the possibility to hookit up in sym. Badseed sounds like a bad idea. You have no choice on how to hang it. Adam from Consolidated Rigging tightened me up also for my bigger PCs. Though I am sounding like a newbie about pc's I assure you that I am a connoisseur of PC'.s
I have inspected gear for the police involved in accidents and fatalities that were totally screwed from the pc construction.
at you kege.i think you mean 4 and 3 load tapes. not 8 and 6.
ripstop is 90 degrees warp and weft. doing a 3 tape means that it would be 15 deg off the bias, Bias is the 45deg between the corners of a square.
this doesnt mean it is bad, just that the pc will rotate in position if it is in sym. There is a post on pc sym that I and BASE689 wrote independently which we didnt take credit for. Who cares. Simple math. 360 divided by 4 or 3 and applied to the square matrix of the f111. 4 makes more sense. But if the pc rotates in position as opposed to orbiting it shouldnt be a prob. I almost ate a wall on an incorrectly constructed pc.
Take care and take care.
space

do you mean that the vents can be actually increasing the probability of oscillation?

No I don´t. I mean that I personally do not believe that venting is the answer to remove PC oscillation, I think the overall symmetry and construction of the PC is far more important. So to make it simple, I believe that PC with crappy design will oscillate even when it´s vented and a well designed (and correct size) PC will not even if it is unvented.

At my own post. I dont say that Badseed is a bad idea. I just say that it is off 15 degrees. assuming they are using small mesh. Big mesh is a different monster to sew. Exactly what I dont want is the inability to hook up my pc symmetrically. If Badseed or any one has a bad day your are screwed with a single attachment without sym adj. This is possible.

I did the first BASE PC's zero P. going dumpster diving with Amanda Eiffel tower number 1. PD wouldnt sell us any material. It had some nasty effects in orbiting. Gotta be really clean on sewing it. Amanda did well.
Back to the subject. Big mesh is normally on a 120 deg warp and weft so 3 tapes should be correct unless the matrix is on the 90 deg.. I think that I am wasting post space, IMHO you should be a rigger before you skydive, much more for BASE one canopy deal. take care and
send me a message if you want to know more about. space