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I have a 210' object that i have S/L several times, and now want to FF, but due to complicated exit point that requires both hands for support, i will have to stow my 48pc. ( i know possible hazards of stowing 48pc leading to hard pulls, but thats not my real concern. Im more concerned with time/distance delay of pc inflation from stowed vs. hand held) I have jumped lower then this before, 200', but hand held. Im 99% sure it will be o.k., but just wanted to run it past a few of ya! Any tips or tricks. Thanks.

http://www.splatula.com/bfl/#bfl128

"The weather was freezing but there was nearly no wind. Papy reportedly knew this 65m (210ft) bridge well and had nearly 200 jumps from it in 2 years with many of them stowed."

and went got in at this same object, probably going stowed... 1 out of 200 is still to risky for most of us...

Put the PC in your mouth. Not joking.
Take care,
space

Done 220 with a stowed 48 and a big old Troll 285. Worked fine. Wouldn't make it my norm though. A lot would also depend on the object and landing areas too. You won't have much height left to do too much after opening. So if it's a solid object I would probably pass as the chances of turning into the dirt trying to correct a big off heading will be greatly increased.

Lots of potential problems with a stowed 48. It seems like a jump-able platform would almost always have a way to go handheld. Gotta get creative. I like the mouth idea. That being said, how big is your canopy? Big difference there, a small canopy+smaller PC means fewer issues w/ going stowed. Have you tried a toxic p/c? Seems that quite a few people will concur that the pull power from a toxic is equal to much larger PCs. Something to consider for more specialized jumps. I've done 210 with a 46", jumping a Flik 266 loaded at .7. Not bad, but that's just one example, obviously to be taken with a grain of salt. There are infinite variables involved in low free-fall, tiny margins for error, and major consequences to contend with.

I would definitely try to avoid stowing a 48" PC, I have done it before on a rather forgiving 350' A, but there was a significant amount of hesitation, and on a really low object, that could be really bad. I don't think it's the time involved with reaching for the PC or anything like that, there isn't a significant amount of time difference from a handheld go and throw, vs pitching right after you jump off. I'd try to figure out a way to get to the exit point going handheld. Or at least get to the exit point, then set up your PC for a handheld jump.

99% sure. That being said the 1% becomes larger than the 99%.

You can flame me later. But whats the point? Is it not dangerous enough? OR is it for the right to say you FF it?

If 99% your right and you land good on ya.
If the 1% and you burn in... it was nice to know ya. I liked your packing video.

I hope your right about the 99% Chris. You've jumped it, can jump it many more times. It's still dangerous no matter how you jump the fucker........

I dont understand how you could tie a static line but cannot go hand held. I think going stowed that low is a bad idea, but that is just my opinion. The lowest hand helds I have done have been 220' with a 48" P/C. I am always open with plenty of altitude, but I think it is a bad idea to go stowed even that low.

People are saying there are issues with PC hesitations when you stow a 48...Ive done multiple aerial jumps from 240-250 and never had an issue stowing mine. mine was kinda old though.
I think it depends alot on the object and the LZ. Stowed off a 210 bridge with a decent lz is alot different than a more tech jump. I think that factors in alot. Of course it can be done...

You got it bro.

My only question: Why go base jumping from a 210 ft object?

Object is a guided 210' tower, no ladder/ outside climb. I carry with me a safety strap that i connect to the tower so i can be hands free to tie off. I then disconnect the safety line, turn around, and exit. But both hands are definitely needed reaching back to hold on before exit. I have tried hand held at the base of the tower, climbing 5ft up, pulling out PC, and then turning around to exit, but it was pretty tough to use 2-3 fingers on the PC of that size, and 2-3 fingers on the tower reaching back in tough position. Really need/want both hands free to hold on for a safe/ semi solid exit. So this is where i struggling with a way to go hand held, and not to sure there is a way.

The PC in the mouth idea is not to bad. Kind of awkward though.

Yes Jordan, I know about Toxic's. I have several. The PC in question is a toxic 48" series 7. I jump for the Asylum team. :) But sound advice, thanks.

Judging by some of your responses, you may feel that this would not be a wise jump to make. And you are partially right, it is not the most straight forward jump. This is a serious level of difficulty for this jump. But remember, we all have different skills, experience levels, and comfort zones. Im very capable/comfortable playing down in the Basement, and on low guided towers for that matter too. But it makes me smile to see the care of our community, so thank you for your concerns. Really!

But this tower is getting Freefalled!

I will think more about this PC in the mouth idea, and give it a few test runs off something different first. I think it could eliminate the hesitation that people have been experiencing when stowed. But Im not really opposed to going stowed either.

So are there any other tricks being used out there these days!

If you can freefall it, you can wingsuit it.

Since you are into living dangerously, why don't you go hand held while facing the tower in a really strong headwind.

You should be able to do your normal climb, get to the top and secure yourself as usual but with a slight variation or two. So here is the sequence...
While facing the tower
Secure to tower. (hands are now free)
Get PC ready in right hand
Grab antenna with left
Now the last thing left is to detach your safety line.
You have a couple of choices...
You could have rigged up a 3 ring release on your safety line (various ways to release) or
you could have secured a hook knife to your right forearm and then cut the safety line.
Now free, you can exit when you feel a strong gust! You should be fine 99% of the time!

I know you are leaving a piece if material tied to the antenna but you can always retrieve it on a later jump.

I'll put some more thought in it and see if I can come up with another way for you to kill yourself!

You say that sarcastically 570. Funny thing is, I already considered this technique, since i have a handful of jumps floating towers in high winds. Nothing this low, but i have floated a 300' tower in roughly about 30mph wind (well that was at exit of course, ground winds were more like 15-18. We flew backwards the whole time. It was an unusual experience to say the least). But I have ruled out this idea for now. Just to low for the good old float! Actually, floating towers in high winds is something done rather frequently here by several people in Nor Cal.

Well, I got the answers i was looking for. Thanks to those that PM'd me with actual technical advice or to tell me that they have already accomplished this type of jump. Your stories sounded exciting! And your advice will be used. Cheers.

Agreed. Except the packing video is Jesse Hall, not Chris Hall.

dude, practice your exits and balance so you don't have to worry about stability from an akward position. It's not you don't have a the perfect place to train...

ask chris kolegas about going stowed with a 48" pc.

Right on. If you already jump toxics, why not throw that 46 on there, and pouch it? Less hard-pull potential, plenty of snatch-force power for (in my extremely non-expert opinion) around a 260 and smaller canopy (the smaller the better). I would personally stow and jump a 46 from this height before I'd consider a 48. (and have). Less material means faster inflation of the p/c, and the fact that you are stowed means your airspeed will be better suited to a 46 (by the time it inflates) than a 48, anyways. But again, so many variables. And I'm assuming you are jumping a seven, whereas my low FFs have been with vented canopies. I also had room for a massive running exit, which makes a huge airspeed difference. Something to consider... Good luck. Don't die. :) And, yeah. definitely not a recommended jump (for anyone reading this) but, to each his own.

hi!

if i understand right the big problem is to turn around when going handheld?

so, what if...

- get another guy that helps you up there (putting together your pc for hh and giving it to you after you turned around)
- find a better way of securing yourself that enables you to turn around and then release? (take a climbing harness, piece of rope and a ladder and play around)
- you rig a platform up there that you get after the jump? (would be nice to have 2 rigs...)
- or just go stowed

i would refrain from 570's idea of taping a hook knife to your forearm when going handheld (and everything else).... ;-)

take care!

You know, you can catch a PC hesitation going from hand just as easily as you would going stowed. I learned that the hard way
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tv-8ovfThGI

How can it be too low to float but not too low for going stowed?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7klHaSfQ5Ds

Good thing that guy wasn't jumping a 210' object.

Hey the negativity given about using a 48 PC

If you do 220 stowed . You should use the PC that you are comfortable with & confident with . If it is a 48, Then I would not shy away from it just because it is a 48-inch .

Having done several hundreds jumps stowed with a 48 . About the only down-fall I can think of . Is on the ( smaller canopies ) it tends to give a little 'drag-distortion' with the pull on the center-cell and can give you a lesser quality on the nicer stand-up landings with the Flair .
.

There maybe another alternative which requires a bit of planning. A friend of mine built a small aluminium plate about the size of a laptop and bolted it onto an object. He jumped it and then removed it afterwards.

Do you need both hands just to turn around or do you need them to stay balanced up until launching as well?

If it's just for turning around, have you looking into rigging your safety line with a load releasable knot like a mariner's or a munter-mule? Might allow you to turn around still attached and then release with one hand and minimal effort.

I hadnt thought about these knots. Just watched video on how to tie them. I will test them out at the base and let you know.

Without knowing what your object looks like, I'm guessing a mariner's would be easier to tie if you're not familiar with the knots, but harder to release. The opposite applies for a munter-mule, although once you've got the munter knot tied, you can easily keep yourself braked while you do the mule knot.

Do you use a biner on your chest strap, a climbing harness or just run your safety directly off your chest strap? Are you planning on tying the knot on your end or on the structure?

Here is a good vid for you of a bridge I've jumped many times. The jumper is not me, I just recognize the bridge. A gainer at about 240' , stowed of course.Go to "youtube.com" try search of "Way to over-rotate" or try the username "sellyselbs" to find it. Worth looking for ....jumper is JTH.

IVE SEEN IT DOUBLED. YOU CANT COMPARE THAT BRIDGE TO A SOLID LOW OBJECT. ITS USER FRIENDLY AND FORGIVING WITH MISTAKES.

I guess the point I was trying to make is that even at 240' , you can take a good delay. So a 210' stowed is safe(ish). A freestanding tower with a flatter landing area vs. The Low bridge with a 45 degree angle landing area with no stable surface. Some big rocks and if you get under the bridge, some rebar waiting to impale you. User friendly.....? It's OK, I guess.

I was jumping with him that day. I think we checked the height and it was 250 or 260 if I remember. I managed to get a double gainer around that day too, with about 3-4 sec of canopy time. Its actually a really user friendly bridge. Sandy side hill and water as an out. Ive been there when it was dry to the lakebed. Other people have doubled it too. 210 stowed when the water level at that bridge makes it 210 is easy. 210 stowed off a guyed antenna is a little different.

Thanks for your reply Slambo, it's nice having a day time bridge nearby for sure. I've always thought the left side hill would be nice to land on. Alot more sandy and rolling, but harder to walk out because of the water trough. I've jumped it when the lake is dry too, upstream and downstream. That is nice sand at the bottom. It's like 300 ft. when it's dry, I think.