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Like all people in the world, the Egyptians are oppressed by their government. I think Al Jazeera has the best coverage of the situation. Here is a link to a live feed of Al Jazeera English. Egypt is an extremely poverty-ridden country, with many Egyptians living in deplorable conditions. I'm guessing that many of these people have nothing else to lose, and everything (their freedom) to gain. Unfortunately, at least according to the news reports (spin?), most people don't realize that freedom is incompatible with democracy.

Dont know why the OP deleted his Post ?

Yes our American media complex as well as Obama speaks-out that (we America) support the power change of there dictator to the new Muslim Brotherhood form of government .

' So Just a thought ', our government traditionally has given our Allie Egypt over a billion a year to buy American Arms from American companies . Besides getting hundreds of millions of dollars in surplus American military equipment. They use American built Weapons like F-16's, Tanks, Helicopters, Navy frigates etc.

So, if the Muslim Brotherhood comes to power in Egypt, Giving the right for free vote to government representation . And since the voting majority of Egypt will then be Sunni Muslim, it is likely they will be eventually voted to ruling power over Egypt . So ???? will the Muslim ruled Egypt then use those Billions-$$$ of American Arms to assault & kill us ?
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I see 2 issues with the picture you paint...

- aid (money) from the US is NOT a given. creative politicians can find ways around agreements.

- there is no reason to assume the Muslim Brotherhood will come to power. while it is one of the few political parties in Egypt, that is because it was permitted by the govt to enable a devils choice between 2 ugly options. the government suppressed other options. the current protesters are by people who love their country (supposedly) and NOT organized by religious fanatics. if true, they represent a third path.



ps
we frequently remove threads where the OP deletes their posts. "Orphan" threads lose continuity quickly.

Quote :
I see 2 issues with the picture you paint...
# 1 - aid (money) from the US is NOT a given. creative politicians can find ways around agreements.
-&-
# 2 - there is no reason to assume the Muslim Brotherhood will come to power. while it is one of the few political parties in Egypt, that is because it was permitted by the govt to enable a devils choice between 2 ugly options. the government suppressed other options. the current protesters are by people who love their country (supposedly) and NOT organized by religious fanatics. if true, they represent a third path.

-

My Rebuttal :
#1
I am not as you say "painting a Picture" & That is not the point I was trying to make, even though it does has relevance to what is going on . What I am saying in my 'previous Post' and the foundation of my last Post . It's not a picture painting but hard fact along with the U.S. Government in the past standing support for Egypt for years to the tune of Billions-$$$$$ of USD & military Arms . & my friend that is a huge endorsement of acceptance for Egypt's past political policy's that has been Projected throughout the world & also them being a strong U.S. Allie .

# 2
You are correct, there is No reason to assume the Muslim Brotherhood will come to power.
Even though the clear Media & U.S. Presidential spoken position of Mubarak stepping down, is fact, along with political faction of ' Muslim Brotherhood ' being Media circulated for the accepted Poster-child and predecessor to Mubarak . This has been regurgitated by the Media non stop since the start .

Your statement of The Muslim Brotherhood & it being of the few political parties in Egypt .
..." while it is one of the few political parties in Egypt, that is because it was permitted by the govt to enable a devils choice between 2 ugly options ".

I find it impossible to accept that the ruling Mubarak & Egyptian governments premeditated plan of choice was to permit the Muslim Brotherhood existence as a standing political party . To enable a choice to it's own demise and replacement ? that does not make sense .

but You do have one thing right. ( Muslim Brotherhood Vs Mubarak ) is the projected devils choice between 2 ugly options . & that is not by choice of Mubarak .
If you disregard the whole ( Muslim Brotherhood Vs Mubarak ) with Friction & Conflict that floods the Media . What simply seems to stand-out is ( Change of Leadership ) . This seems to be the underlying theme pushed with Media support . Also the underlying theme in our own President & his new-found political position of non-support and paint Mubarak as the black-sheep . When our U.S. Government and with every Presidential regime in the past has hard standing in Egypt & policies .

Basically in my last Post & making of point was . When all this unrest in Egypt does ends & it will . And ' If ' there is this (Change of Leadership) and Egypt is free from Mubaraks rule .
& my MAJOR POINT WAS . Will there be Free Election then introduced to Egypt & it's populace with the new Government faction?
& with No Picture Painting Here . (Change of Leadership) is happening as is the predicted outcome . & with a huge possibility of introduction of Free-Election of Government Representation leading to Egypt's major population majority coming to rule with a military powerhouse of U.S. funded hardware @ there fingertips . So please re-read my statement in my last Post of .

" So, if the Muslim Brotherhood comes to power in Egypt, Giving the right for free vote to government representation . And since the voting majority of Egypt will then be Sunni Muslim, it is likely they will be eventually voted to ruling power over Egypt . So ???? will the Muslim ruled Egypt then use those Billions-$$$ of American Arms to assault & kill us ?
.

I think you missed my points as well.
<sigh>

if your main concern is US military aid coming back to bite the US in the butt, then are you suggesting the US STOP all military aid? (that is the only true way to prevent your concern.)

They may not get funding from us at this moment . I am sure the current US leadership is threatening to pull or withhold future funding to get what they are pushing for there planned agenda on Egypt's government.
I think it's great, (so far) looks like Mubarak will not be stepping down under pressure from the our current US leadership & the Media circus . So for now Egypt will not be in threat of total Islamic rule given to them by false cover of democracy .
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you fear Islamic rule in Egypt, based on what?

the crowds apparently lack Islamic fervor. they prefer national pride. the people feel oppressed by corrupt government.

Turkey is a democracy and ally. it is also decidedly Islamic.

Mubarak remaining in power may not be a great thing for the US/Egypt relations. if the people think the US is helping keep him in power, then expect an anti-US backlash. it actually might set the stage for the outcome you fear.

the countries who WANT Mubarak to remain tend to be those that want to protect their power, NOT let the people have more say.

I don't fear as much as I have a clear distaste for Islam .

I was not anticipating or expecting seeing any crowds of ' Islamic fervor ' especially being reported in Media coverage, even though Islam is the dominant religion in Egypt and the entire region .
looks like today it is going-down . I was surprised that Mubarak did step-down because 'Mob Rule mentality' usually does not play out well for those in the 'Mob' . Media announced that Power is being passed to be held by the Military (Very soft Mil.Cuw) till a things can be formally changed over to more people orientated gov. representation . but I just can not get over how this Egyptian Mob Rule Revolution looks manipulated & guided from outside it's borders from start to present .
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I wonder why you feel that way?

the curious thing to me is the lack of apparent leadership. the crowds are NOT coalescing around any particular figure. normally, the masses get manipulated by a charismatic person (who might be heavily influenced by outside interests).

without a high-profile leader, I feel confused as to how the outside COULD influence events (other than via envy by the Egyptians).

after what, 30+ years of martial law?, I'm guessing the population suffers from a certain amount of fatigue from bad government. I could be wrong...

sorry late reply, Long & busy weekend .

Even though Egypt's population suffers from a certain amount of fatigue from bad government & that would be putting it mildly .
I think it a little funny that now all of the sudden a dictator for the past 30 years & 'in control' of his country & also with his own Army & who had 'no problem' in the past squashing any and all opposition to him with arresting, torture/questioning and/or imprisoning to anyone in connection to groups with pro-activism & regime change . Now turns it all over for new written constitution & outcome of democratic free elections .
NOW decides to step-down to just hand over all his power & this happens -' Without' - any outside influence pushing him to this ???
& put that with several WikiLeaks confidential documents posted that Secretary of state & US Embassy officials were in regular contact with the activist throughout 2008 and 2009. It looks pretty damning for the possibility of this being Non- Influence with outside support .

Not Whoville on Christmas Eve & Mubaraks heart did Not chose on it's own accord to grow three sizes that day with compassion and love for change .

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i4F6b_199dQ
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mostly, I agree.

but I disagree he left because his heart grew. it really wasn't a Grinch style epiphany, IMHO.

he ran the country. he controlled it. he might have had close moments in the past, but pulled it out. he tried to do it this time as well. I bet he did not want to leave. heck, he proclaimed he would stick around when everyone thought he would resign.

nope, I'm guessing he realized the military would not go brutal on the people, which was the only valid option left to him. he either left when he could, or get run out of dodge.

the military left his cabinet in charge, for now. Mubarak is doing a calculated retreat to preserve all his money and influence. it's better choice than getting strung up by a mob!

not really a great choice.


(had he suffered a Grinch style moment, he would be giving his palaces back to the Egyptian people!)

Precisely what I said, Mubaraks heart did not spontaneously just grow 3x with love & compassion to give up his power of country . Just Exactly like the Egyptian Mob-Rule protests in Egypt was Not a Spontaneous social revolt . ( t takes Time & Planning ) for both Mubaraks being forced out & the staging of pro-activism for Democracy . Yes Egypt's populous is unhappy with Mubaraks rule but this whole thing was played-off by the Media circus and presented as some sort of spontaneous explosion of pro-democratic activism for Mubaraks removal .
I also in No Way agree with you that military would not go brutal on the people & not there only valid option . They are well versed as strong-arming unrest with also being well trained with quality equipment .They are the ONLY obvious choice to chose for populous control over Mubarak or Muslim Brotherhood. (imho) after strong negotiation Egypt's military must have been given a choice ( a better deal ) not to back Mubarak . & that is the reason they are in full enforcement control with martial law @ this moment .
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after 30 years of Mubarak and martial law, that pot had been simmering for a long time.

I've seen many protests flame up in the US, and I can't think of any that I'd say were controlled by "outside interests." (of course, that did not stop Nixon and McCarthy from claiming outside interference in the '50's.)

TV, movies, facebook, twitter all can present views of how life CAN be. thus, many rulers opt for control of the media, when they can.

dictators love to blame an outside source since they need an enemy to rally the people. they blame all their issues on this perceived threat and distract the people from bad government.

generally, the "threat" is just a red herring.

by repeating the "outside powers" charge, you repeat a Mubarak line.

if you want to blame TV and media, then you can level the same charge about Fox News stoking the Tea Party movement, the birther charge, the Muslim charge, etc. humans populate the US and are as flawed as any other!

oh, and the military is the only Egyptian alternative with a power structure in place. (I'm sure they have vested interests to protect as well.) no other group was ready to step up. typically when the US (or other government) is behind the turmoil, they have a henchman waiting to assume power. none have stepped forward.

I am getting pretty fatigues with thinking about Egypt, also looks like we will not agree on this . but in No Way this a spontaneous revolt & power change . It took time with planning .
also Media is both complete Tool as well being used as a Tool from beginning .

-
" oh, and the military is the only Egyptian alternative with a power structure in place. (I'm sure they have vested interests to protect as well.) no other group was ready to step up. typically when the US (or other government) is behind the turmoil, they have a henchman waiting to assume power. none have stepped forward." .

I repeat, Media is both complete Tool as well being used as a Tool from beginning .
you say, No other group was willing to step forward ??? . It is a fact . The overwhelming choice presented in the beginning of the American Media Onslaught was promoted daylight till dark as ( Muslim Brotherhood -Vs- Mubarak ) from the very start . With the same being regurgitated from out the mouth of our current President .

There will also be several interests stepping forward for the leading position when elections are finally held .
& Who do you think will be the likely Victor when Elections are held ?
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I'm reminded of the superb Richard Bach:
Clouds don't worry about
falling into the sea because
they can't (a) fall or (b) drown.
But they are free to believe they can,
and they may fear
if they wish.

I choose trust over fear, thus we perceive things differently. you see an organized event, while I do not. you may be right. time might tell.

peace out.