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i believe these are the only two true options! i hate this world so much it makes me wana just get on the meds they say i need and sit at home all the time!

Why only those 2 options?

I think it will grow the sport and make more people aware of BASE jumping, there in part making more objects legal

after typing and deleting and typing and deleting over and over i give up... i cant even describe all the reasons and at all the levels this makes me sick. am i going crazy or getting selfish or is this a legit feeling?! seriously. givin the track record of responses i read on here and iv gotten personally i know this should start a good bashing soon so let me hear it!

your definitely entitled to your own thoughts/feelings.

But the fact you can't put them out there is the problem.

State your position and reasons why/how it is "bad"

in short... its too good to give to just anybody! base is special for a lot of reasons. it should be kept as pure as possible. people should have to work to get something this good! nobody wants to work for anything anymore and it disgusts me!!!!!

I don't jump, so I generally don't post much here, just lurk, so take this with a huge grain of salt, BASE is already a SUPER sketchy event in which so much can go wrong, without having 200lbs of flailing meat attached to a "instructor"(i guess that's what they'd be called) and I'm sure theres just people itching to close whatever few legal sites there are out there, now take into account the death of a tandem student, thats like throwing a jug of gas into a fire, nothing good will come of it. The anti-BASE supporters out there would have a field day with an incident like that.

Again, just my non jumping, usually lurking, take on the issue.

and pure love should be treated with respect between two equals. No sex before marriage! Those who do not have the pure love should not be allowed to have sex.

Good or bad? That's for the twin falls locals to decide ( which some are involved). Before it was just seen as people accepting the risking of their life for a hobby and freedom they enjoy ( with the benefit of free and unique tourist entertainment) ......: but now it's turned into a buisness for profit and unregulated. Worst case I forsee is legal action to whoever is involved if a serious accident occurs and the making of perine jumps illegal ( real base jump :-). I imagine lawyers will be making comparisions to skydiving regulations, FAA rules, and therefore no regulation in this new venture.

No need in always complaining, it doesn't affect me so have fun and be safe. No matter how it turns out, Ill be seeing you guys for some legal or maybe by then illegal jumps :-)

While I'd love to watch the aftermath of a tandem base bounce. Odds of one happening are mighty low. Exiting over water, PCA... Not much can kill you there. But we can always hope for the worst.

I've heard that argument for years, and I can't think of a site that is now more open to BASE (in the US). I can think of places that are less friendly.


did I miss something? got any examples? are you just hopeful?

Is that a good thing. It's getting crowded out there dude...

So is it because of the "easy in" that people have into BASE that upsets you or that you think what they are doing is dangerous?

+1

Its going to be good though... handicam footage should provide great entertainment!

most of it is the "easy in". no respect or dues paid. i got in the old way. and i wish everybody had to. having to pay your dues and spend time money effort and wait is what keeps objects from gettin burned. i'v got lots lots lots more to say about this whole topic but not enough time in the day to type that much!

That's getting in the hard way? 70 skydives in 2 years and looking online for a mentor? You gotta be shitting me.

For the record, I got in an easy way. I took a manufacturer's course.

When a tandem passenger makes a tandem BASE jump or tandem Skydive, does that suddenly make them a BASE jumper or Skydiver? Is it a really an easy "in" into the sport? Will any of the people teaching FBJC's allow tandem BASE jumpers into their course without the mandatory skydiving prerequisites? Will the City of Twin Falls ban BASE jumping after the first tandem goes "in"? A number of people have died already and it's still legal to jump. The city has too much to loose in the terms of revenue that BASE jumpers bring in, and not to mention the tourists who enjoy watching BASE jumping. Yes, it might be a touchy subject for some who have a deep love and respect for BASE. If history is any indication, tandem BASE might do for the sport what tandem Skydiving has done, and that is help grow the sport. Maybe it's the growth that makes us uneasy, we don't know if the growth will be a positive thing for change is uncertain.

I also took a manufacturer's course, it was a pretty easy in. I don't really see someone doing a tandem BASE jump as them getting "in" to BASE. I see it more as an amusement park ride.

If you do base to feel superior because you "worked" hard to do it, and not everyone can do what you do, you aren't jumping for the right reasons. Any dipshit like me can buy a rig off the classifieds and go jump. It doesn't take a tandem for someone to do it. I think your hatred for base tandem is a deep rooted insecurity that someone not as special as you can do what you do, and therefore you don't feel as cool. Someone said it before on these forums, base-jumping does not make you a unique snowflake. If you are doing it for the "wow" factor of wuffos, you are the one stripping base from it's pure form, not the tandems.

HOLY SHIT! You're alive! We thought you went in!

Hows that base number going?... ohhh thats right.

Good work pointing out the wrong reasons for jumping, you seem to be going about it for all the right reasons.

As much as he is a douche I don't wish or want to see any jumper or for that matter anyone going in. +1 for his last post tho.

let's look at the history. can you cite a single instance where publicity has helped open up an object (in the US) to BASE jumping?

obviously, it never worked for El Cap. it hasn't worked (yet) for the NRGB. I could easily cite 2 other locations that are "closed" after too much public exposure.

"publicity will help BASE" sure seems more of a faith, a belief, than a reality.

(I have no problem with this operation. they can do it for fun, profit, the challenge, to upset other jumpers, to develop gear, etc. without regulation, it matters little. claiming it will "improve BASE," "generate more support for BASE," etc. hasn't been supported by any evidence that I am aware.)

what facts am I missing? please educate me. I'd like to know if there is something other than kool-aid out there.

A small percentage of Tandem Skydivers go through AFF and become skydivers. Perhaps a small percentage of Tandem BASE jumpers will be hooked and go on to become BASE jumpers. That's all that I meant by growth, no more no less.

wow. do you really have 11 jumps?

you have the right to your opinion, but no one that actually base jumps gives a shit.

you don't even have a clue of what you don't know.

do you even own BASE gear, or did you spend all your money on GoPros?

props on the leg work and reading though. bravo.

Hey Cale, it's not really the correct question. You know me. I've been jumping 39 years, BASE for 29. BASE tandem is inevitable given todays equipment, the Potato Bridge and other water bridges, and the level of interest generated by You Tube and the like. Any "extreme" sport will ultimately reach that point so long as there are places it can be done with very little skill. Don't get too upsent to think these people are really getting into BASE jumping. Most tandem skydiving students never come back. It's a carnival ride they saw on You Tube. The thing to watch for is that "Experts" who decide to be BASE tandem masters, need to stick to water bridges unless they are really experienced. I saw film of Thor Alex, (5'6" tall) with a 6'2" tandem student on his belly go off a cliff in Andalsness. The student carried Thor on his back off the exit. For an inexperienced BASE jumper, it would have been crazy, but Thor Alex and the student had their shit together. BASE tandem is NOT a way to enter BASE, like it is skydiving. IF it ever becomes so, we'll see the stats get even worse.
Potato bridge, carnival ride. Any other BASE jump, not a good idea.

 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tyc-nzLtTXI

edit: another I had come across. This not over water.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oml71o0RHUk

disclaimer: sharing these links does not say I support or am keen on doing tandem BASE. I feel thinking of Tandem BASE is pretty natural given the "what next?" tendency people(experts) have in any sport. So just out of curiosity I looked for them a long time back and got these. I would be pretty surprised if anyone here haven't seen these videos already.

 

uhhh, i doubt it.

any idiot can BASE jump... it's not that special. i don't dream about it at all.

yes i've met Rick. great guy. so what?

have you ever jumped with me? i'm pretty fucking awesome too.

lmao! that is def guna be my quote of the day! i love it and with ur permission i will be using it! oh and yeah iv got gear... i also spend 5k on gopros and dont hafta giva fuck! i was trying to be nice but ran into way too many smart ass prick fucks like u so i wont be doing that again dont worry ;) and good point Rick. it just kinda spooked me a ltl bit i guess and got me all pissy lol :)

had some time and decided to chime in on this..... as a new base jumper who started after 9 years and 2500 sky dives .... who cares what people do off the potato as long as it stays open ........ theirs many way's to find the path to base ...... not many walk the distance ...... its up to you to find a crew that shares your beliefs, but don't throw shit at those who walk a different path, most times it just gets thrown back ... thus a shit fight and every one smells :o)

There are people who make their living from different object, Be respectful ...... if you are going to take some shit head on a tandem do it some place where there and your death will not affect the the rest of us .... peace pot and micro dot :o)

that's the best point i've heard yet.

I dont give a shit about tandem base - I don't even have a particular opinion on whether the perrine stays open. it is certainly nice to have as an option, and i appreciate it's value as an example of legal objects, but it's not cheap for me to get there, and id just as soon spend the money going somewhere new.

treerat brings up an important consideration - i'd be interested to hear some input on from the potentially affected parties - What about jimmy / marta, tom, and all the other people whose commercially viable training courses depend on the bridge staying open? does anyone know how they feel? are they concerned?

Thats the only thing that I fear is tandem base getting the bridge shut down. Ethic say if your traveling into an area to jump you call the "locals" and not to burn their objects, and if the locals burn the objects it was theirs to burn ooh well....But I think the Perrine although it has locals is everyones object and is the responsibility of everyone to maintain it as a vital base object, and not turn it into something that could get it closed somehow.

Im not saying it will or wont, but when you add in people who think its just a carnival ride and even if they sign waviers and all that bullshit and someones daughter goes in, we could all find that bridge in a world of shit by finding out that daughters dad was some congressman, or some old fuck with millions of dollars that can sit back and lobby the local town and government to hell and back.

Also I know its a business, and people are trying to make money, but there are also others there trying to make money off that bridge too, and im sure they would be pissed to get booted out for sure.

Last thing is that you normally think this kind of thing would be remote and only happen every so often so there is going to be a high risk but low exposure, like the halo tandems that cost thousands of dollars so it only gets done a couple times a year, but they are charging a small ass fee to get a jump opening it up to alot of people, and we all know you keep doing it long enough what happens.

Roux Crew!

I wonder who's going to get Tandem BASE #1

better questions is how soon someone makes the list for a tandem jump - 2 names, one jump...

What is more commercially viable about these courses?
These first jump courses are no more legit than tandemBASE. There are no permits, insurance, or permission in place for any of these "commercial" operations that have been going on for some time now. The bridge is still open.
If anything TandemBASE will bring even more people to Twin Falls to feed the local economy. It's a win win situation for the town.

Your all just jealous that you didn't think of it first.

First, i actually have no personal interest in the tandem base issue - if it works, great. if not, i hope nobody is hurt (physically or financially) in the failure process.

Regarding the comparison between differing comercially viable operations, i made the following point earlier in a PM to someone:
Courses like Apex, Tom's, etc typically are not advertised to the general public (*1), they prequalify applicants, and operate with a degree of professional responsibility (*2).

*1 - by general public, i am referring to non-skydiving persons, with little or no knowledge of canopy flight, risks involved, and who may have no desire to continue in the sport of base.
*2 - i am not inferring that tandem base is professionally irresponsible. simply stating that the service offered is profit for entertainment, not profit for education purposes. I am sure tandem base has done their due dilligence in preparing the equipment, personnel and safety plans.

My previous post was a response to what i thought to be a good point - other arguments were primarily emotion-driven. people pissed off because of how the issue made them "feel." The concern for other entities who rely on the bridge remaining open was the first logical argument potentially against tandem base that i read.

i dont care what happens - keep the bridge open, and keep everyone safe. Good luck.

I wonder if JB will accept one hundred tandem BASE jumps for BD?

Nah, just about everybody has "thought" of it; it just takes a certain type of person with the drive and/or balls to make it happen.

My advice to everybody is to pull your panties out of your ass and go about your business, it really doesn't affect you at all (I know it doesn't me). Do you really think a bunch of yahoo's just got together one day and cobbled together some outlaw business to take advantage of the huge untapped potential of Tandem BASE jumping?

Everything I see about it shows a fairly large amount of thought, planning and professionalism going into it. You'd have to be pretty stupid to think that the city council and any other stakeholders are unaware of the situation or the potential consequences that may arise. There is absolutely no more inherent liability in running a BASE operation from a Federally funded bridge than there is running a skydive operation from a Federally funded airport.

Hey, shut your mouth! You are just jealous because you don't have a 7:1 post to jump ratio. Those kind of stats mean you are the hot s**t so watch out!!

It would be great if the tandem instructor had a cutaway for his student in case the student was going to cause the instructor to potentially die. There I was in freefall and I jettisoned my passenger to ensure my survival.

Better be nice you need a new source for video footage.

so, just to clear some things up...

1. you started a really stupid, one sided poll, with which you knew you'd catch some flack. when you got it, your panties got all bunched up.


2. just because someone on this website doesn't actually "know" you, do you really think we all forget all the other dumb posts you've made? we know you the exact way you've represented yourself online thus far. is it accurate? maybe, maybe not. i don't have to care, it is what it is. and again for the record, your posts make you look pretty dumb.


3. if you're going to fill out your profile, i'm going to assume it's accurate. is it? maybe, maybe not. again, i don't have to care, i'm just going to go with that. so, 11 jumps in almost a year since your first jump... i'm not saying there is some race to get a million jumps, but that is pretty weaksoss.

4. the whole point to my initial reply was truly to try and understand why you feel like you even deserve to pass judgement on other actual BASE jumpers and there actions when you yourself talk about doing things the hard way and doing your time.

anyway, you can call me a prick all you want, it doesn't change how you are representing yourself. i didn't do anything to you, you did it to yourself. you laughed at my "pretty fucking awesome" line because you don't know me to know that it's true. i accept that. just like i don't know you to know that you're not a completely uneducated douche-canoe. no hard feelings, i just dislike your dumb posts. who cares what i think? pretty much just me, but this is the internet and man is it entertaining.

sorry it took me until now to explain this... although i don't usually work very hard, they do pay me a lot of money to do stuff, so occasionally i get busy with my job and cannot be online all day long. that, and i've been out jumping.

so seriously, good luck with your BASE career... but maybe tone down the dumb posting and make some jumps... or not. either way, i'm happy.

MxCale is probably one of the most hardcore jumpers I have ever, ever met. He's a natural who's done some of the scariest that I've ever been on.

yes i agree completely. you have to earn the right to base jump.

I tend to think differently.
anyone, fool or not, can jump.

through work, effort, study, etc. someone can truly understand many bits of information that can improve their odds of success. (I have yet to hear a jumper with a few dozen jumps look back and say, "Wow, I was so over-prepared!")

"Wow, I was so over-prepared!"

In 10 years of parachuting I have only heard
that statement once, from a small guy who
was upset that we would not let him fly a
sub-100 wing till he had more jumps.

He later committed suicide so I guess we
should have let him swoop a Velo-96 with
less than a 100 jumps, might have saved
some poor maid from finding his headless
corpse in a hotel room.

Oh and Cale, yeah, Blitzkrieg is known
by different names in different places
but his level of awesomeness remains
basically constant.

The funniest thing about this thread is I have jumped with both of you and you are both pretty cool guys. I'd say it's your similarities that have caused this little online tiff.

I was with Cale on his 5th jump on a VERY technical jump, one of the more technical jumps I have ever made and I really didn't believe it was his 5th jump. Cale is VERY enthusiastic about this sport and as 460 pointed out really is a natural.

His fault is not knowing enthusiasm and passion are strictly forbidden on this forum

Keep doing what you're doing...both of you. I have a feeling you guys are going to run into each other one day if you havent already and just didnt know it.

As far as tandem base goes? Who cares. This isnt a new idea.

I think it's safe to say that commercial tandem base is not going to become a widespread phenomena, so why care so much??? The perrine is already the village bicycle.
To the people that voiced the idea that "base is something that should be earned" or that this somehow takes away from the sanctity of BASE: I'm curious what your motives for jumping are. As far as I can tell, no person who jumps for purely personal reasons would harbor this belief.

yes, it seems as though you are still saying they are earning the right through preparation and work.

nope. no one must earn the right to jump.

effort and preparation simply earns respect. to me, it shows they care about their own well being and thus respect themselves. face it, if they don't respect themselves enough to increase their own survival rate, why should anyone else show them respect?

there is a big difference.

il try to make this my last post. no promises but il try. i dont mind people giving me $%!^ and i know alota times its guna happen especially on sumthin like this. however there is a huge difference in me and the vast majority of the online comunity apparently in that i wont say anything anywhere online that wouldnt normally come outa my mouth if i were to be face to face with anybody. it humors me that people like blitz for instance coulda stuck to just giving me $#^ but instead had to add a ltl personal attack with the "do u even have gear or did u blow all ur money on gopros" bit. funny as hell cuz i gaurantee that he wouldnt say that to my face. and way to throw it in my face that i laid out 5Gs to help out anybody on here who wanted a killer deal so they could afford a camera if they couldnt before. if anybody disagrees with my posts or questions me as a jumper then feel free to argue a point! by all means have at it cuz it take alot to make me mad. tell me i'm stoopid or a tard or too ignorant to even post cuz i only have 10 jumps or 15 jumps or 50 jumps or wutever the general population of this board has figured to be an acceptable number of jumps. and to all those who bag on me for jumpin for a year and only having 12 jumps i apologize but i dont have a local mentor or local jump friends plus i worked out of town for the last 8months and i'd rather not grease spot a perfectly good object cuz i wana rush and get another jump so i can hurry home and update my status on here. i will be in base for a long time. i would love to jump with as many of u as possible. i would welcome most any of u into my house for a weekend of jumps. i would likewise like to buy a round or two of drinks after the weekend was over and talk base or wutev. i dont try to hide behind any crazy names. my name is cale and i'm super easy to find or to contact. but im NOBODY'S bitch! i should be off work for a cpl months now and if anybody wants a gopro plenty available btw :) and thanks to my homeboys defending me! i wish fun and safe jumps to most of ya! adios

Who cares. I'm glad someone found a way to make money while BASE jumping.

Holy posting from a cell phone, that was difficult to read

Go make a jump with Blitz, you'll have fun.

Homer simpson on mem day weekend (when i broke my ankle night jumping it because some asshole let a tree grow there) was one of your first jumps, right? like one or two? that was the most frightening climb ive ever had, and i have never been more uncomfortable on top of an object.

i couldnt imagine doing that in my first 10-20 jumps.

kcollier... learn to courtesy flush dickweed! LMAO =P haha! that was a crazy weekend! still cant believe u hit 1 of 5 frikkin trees in two dam acres lmao still! so glad u hit that tree tho!!!! we'v looked at it again and again and u would got REALLY REALLY EFFED UP if it hadnt stopped u! and opening that was my second jump... what an amazing jump! rick harrison and a whole crew of heavy hitters in the base community... i still feel honored as hell yall stayed with me. come back for revenge jump anytime :)

Hey Pussies
Cale, i thought i told you to stay off of the forums.
Sorry to be so late in posting. I have been snowed in all week without access to a computer, tragic. Yeah, home alone with nothing but my local 280' freestander within walking distance and some killer weed. The only thing missing is my tall blond lady, also snowed in but in a different place. Fuck the snow.
Thanks jdatc for the review of Cales original post seeking a mentor. I remember that one. Via PM I explained to Cale that while I wasen't experienced enough to mentor anyone, he was certainly welcome to come along with me whenever he wanted. After all, I had only made a couple hundred BASE jumps that summer. that weekend he was at my home DZ. Now keep in mind that i am only a student skydiver........4300 jumps, no ratings, no license, no USPA membership. However, based on my inexperience I would say that Cale is an excellent skydiver. Most importantly, he could land his canopy on a fuckin dime, consistently. We spent many hours talking BASE on the phone and in person. I still refused to take him out BASE jumping. Soon afterwards I got a call from Cale. He had scouted a fuckin awesome B and wanted me to take a look, HELL YEAH. It turned out to be a crane jump. Being up there alone talking on the radio with Cale down on the street almost made me feel bad, almost. Most excellent jump.........Downtown Nashville, fuckin pigs in sight from the exit point. Cale drove the getaway car, thanks man. I enjoyed it so much i went back and did it again, and Cale helped on that one also. Actually, not counting the cave in Mexico, some of my best jumps have been made possible by my friend Cale.
Cale nagged me day and night to take him out for his first jump. I put him off every way i could think of while we continued to skydive and he continued to ground crew for BASE. I didn't make it easy for him. Finally one day he showed up with a BASE rig, top end gear and even my favorite colors. I started to simply take his rig for my growing collection. He said he was ready, many times. I finally said fuck it and reminded him that it was his ass. If he fucked up i was taking his rig off of him and leaving him where he impacts, or so I said. 320' freestander. I did insist on a PCA. Cale's focus and calmness at the exit point was nothing short of amazing, even with me speaking of how nervous i was. Perfect exit, perfect canopy flight, perfect landing on target. Cale did exactly as I told him, much to my relief. The world looks different now. More jumps with Cale convinced me that he was indeed ready for BASE. An occupied condo B him and me did was fuckin awesome. Again, he set it up, and invited me along. It is easily the most technical jump i have ever done. I was at the point of backing down, but again, Cales focus and calmness changed my mind. Recently i had the honor of jumping with Cale for his first E. Congrats on your BASE # bro!!!
I am proud to say that I am Cale's mentor. I am proud to say that Cale is my first student. It's nice to give something back to this wonderful sport. Cale has more than paid his dues. Hell, he even bought me some taco bell food after our first jump, and bought me a ham/biscuit after a different jump. If that's not paying dues then someone tell me what the fuck is.
Blitz, what's up Elliot? Man, that's the most sad post i have ever read. Of course it TAKES an idiot to BASE jump. But...."It's not that special"??????, "I don't dream about it at all"?????????? Why put yourself at the risk then? BASE is very special to me and i dream about it most every night. BASE jumping is the best, well, the second best sensation i've ever felt. Dude, we need to jump together more so i can see that awesomness everyone speaks about. All i have seen so far are some cool tattoos and sloppy pack jobs You know i love you brother.
Matt, will you do a jump-to-post ratio on me please. I can never do math good when i am stoned. Now i am at 722, but will be at least 725 by the time you read this.
Do you guys remember the special jump I invited you both on? Guess who that object belongs to.....MxCale indeed. We are all much closer and connected than we realize.
Cale has my respect. Take my word for it guys, look past the Red hair and big mouth and you will find a heart of gold, and a skilled BASE jumper.
Well, I have calm wind and a half moon. More than enough light in the snow. If the reaper visits me tonight I will be waiting to greet you all at the gates of Hell. I have been promised a special place there by the master.
321 CYA
Pete Certain 683

Oh, I almost forgot. Tandem BASE makes me fuckin sick. It is a dishonor to the sport and to all involved. If it goes on long enough it will get the potato closed.

oh Pete... i was waiting for you to post...

what's this forum for if not to stir up some shit?


don't get me wrong, i love me some base jumping... i just don't let it control my life. don't worry bud, we'll make some jumps again soon.

...and for the record, i don't take risks, i make calculated mistakes.