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Interested to find out how many people route their pins out of the container (middle or bottom) then bottom pin -> top pin -> direct to PC.

also if anyone has had any problem with this type of routing....

Cheers
Paul.

I always route my bridal between the grommets. And for handheld the top pulls first everything else bottom pin pulls first. For handheld it helps keep the bridal from snagging on the bottow corners of rig.

I remember being told that when you go HH the pull/snatch force should always go direct to the pin and not via a piece of velcro or 'tucked in' like some people do!

If the pins are set up to go, top first then bottom, can anyone see any problems with that?

I know that some jump with the bridle coming out between the gromets rather than the top. Would anyone care to expand on this. Good or bad experiences? If you route your bridle bottom pin first then top, which side do you bring your bridle out? Left or right? Any problems with either way?

Also, does anyone know of any incidents where a bridle has snagged on the bottom of the container or flaps with a rig that is set up for bottom pin out first???

Apex teaches one way and Snake river teaches the other, so I would say both are copetant.

It just makes more sense to let the bridle come from the top if you are going hh because then it can't get hung up at the corner of your rig. therefore it totally makes sense to reverse the bridle if you plan on going hh. that way you don't have to tuck it somewhere

i jump regularly HH; never reversed it and can't see a reason to. that said, i'm not FF crazy low objects. my usual objects are around 245-275. i have also SL a cliff twice that was sub 250; i routed the bridle top to bottom.

I'm not sure I understand the benefit. I remember reading somewhere that having your bridle reversed will make it easier for your pins to pop. In my mind it would be just as effective to have each pin in their normal spot but orient your pins so that they will not "flip" when they are pulled (I happen to think that this is completely unnecessary). Having the bridle reversed so that it won't catch the bottom corner of your rig is all fine and good, but having it oriented normally and tucking it into your flap works just as well.
I guess what I'm getting at is that it will not likely make any noticeable difference when it comes time for your PC to yank your canopy out. Unless you are some super brilliant savant that can remember how many femto-seconds it took for your pins to pop.
If you want to be hip and new skool, go ahead and flip your bridle. Your canopy will come out. If you want to be a total square you can leave the bridle just how it always was. your canopy will still come out. If I'm missing something, please clue me in.

Flipping your shrivel flap, on the other hand is totally bitchin.

Exactly, and that way you can route your bridle same for all different kind of jumps/packjobs. More simple.
Makes it also easier if you decide to go stowed!

the only benefit i can see by "reverse rigging" is if you're doing a really low jump and intend on maintaining a head high attitude, or you just suck, and always have poor body position and bridle control.

personally, i don't ever change the way i close a rig. consistency serves me well and i always try to maintain the most ideal body position during exit.

also, i maintain strict bridle control (tension) which would fail to allow the bridle to move to the bottom of the container during the jump. doing so also eliminates the need for re-rigging.

TIFWIW.

Flipping your shrivel flap ... is totally bitchin

Nice!!

I reverse rigged the bridle once but the pins seemed kinda close to the PC so I didn't jump it.

ditto

Chris please diatribe why you think this other than have taken 1 course and that they are both professional courses?

Break it down barney style so that the audience knows fully where you are coming from.

Barney Fife or the Purple Dinosaur?

Both actually work about the same.

i have a couple of stowed jumps with reversed pins,route the bridle back down under the flap and it works fine.
handheld for me usually means short delay and being head up so it totally makes sense.
as for consistency---i prefer preparing every packjob to the object/jump/delay and not just pack for another jump.
the "ideal" body position varies.

I hate Barney the purple frickin dinosaur! All that "caring and sharing crap"

In apex's packing video and course they don't teach the reverse bridal thing, they use the normal set up, bridal out the top into the pack job, if PCA or static line bridal runs back up the rig to the velcro tab or tucks under the riser cover to take up slack blah blah blah. Like Blizt said correct body position will prevent issues with this type of routing. Snake river uses the reverse bridal with the bridal passing out of the rig between the pins, I was shown this by a new jumper that didn't really specify the positive points of the method, but more of a "here is what I was shown" kinda thing. I also sat through Tom's briefing at B-Day for continuing ed, he descibed this there two but not in detail. You know how the don't die on bridge day courses are. I am not positive on why they prefer this method, maybe asking TOM and Jimmy would solve this a bit faster.

I'm not convinced there is anything to resolve. surely if there was a significant reason, someone would have chimed in with a decent explanation.

it certainly sounds like a difference in personal preference and NOT something critical to safety.

it might be appealing to specialists such as ultra-low jumpers, but few do that. (hence the term "specialist.")

Ditto

It's all about VOODOO!!!!!!!!!!!!

this is not the thread about the BASE wizard.

Were you told this for the same reason as sacrificing a chicken (as in it makes no sense but if it makes you feel better do it)? or some actual logical reason? I am interested, as I have always had a small velcro square put onto my shoulder and bridle to keep the bridle tidy on HH (especially for solos).... I have never had a problem (and nor has anyone I know with making a tuck)... but would like to hear if anyone has (with pin rigs)?

Thanks

I accepted that it seemed reasonable that the pull force should go direct to the pin. Maybe I should have questioned it more. I also must admit that it does make me feel better at the exit point if I know the bridle is going straight to the pin.

Let's assume that a jumper has had a shit exit and is head high (the person is in a stand up position). Bridle is attached, by velcro, at the top of the rig. If the velcro is in good condition could it be possible that it does not seperate. I guess the bridle would have to be running straight up and down for this to happen. This is not an unlikely scenario. I've had a few 'starman' jumps myself

Am I completely underestimating the amount of pull/snatch force? What if it was a go and throw. No delay, straight off and let the PC go. That would mean less snatch force than with a delay of whatever time.

I doubt having the bridle tucked in would cause a problem but velcro???

If it's a good idea to use velcro to ensure the bridle does not snag the bottom of the rig on a HH exit, why don't the major manufacturers stick a piece of velcro on the bridle and the rig???

Cheers
Parky

A small Velcro patch is not a factor.

The piece was often put on the bridle and the rig from the factory. It's pretty much replaced by just tucking a little part of the bridle in but some rigs still have them.

agreed.

also, do not tuck the bridal between shoulder and shoulder strap (friction is body position dependent) tuck it into the container between flaps an inch or so.

What is more likely to happen, looping your bridal under your rig during say...a running exit, or a square inch piece of felcro or a tuck burning you in from hesitation? I go with tuck or velcro on my jumps.
My two cents.

Thanks for all replys and input on this!! One other issue that hasn't been mentioned - As the 1st part of the canopy to be extracted from the container is usually near the top, the top pin popping 1st will give the top end of the container more time to open before the canopy extracts - so less chance of one side of the canopy catching on one of the flaps causing an offheading........ Maybe

That's a good point. I don't like the idea of running my bridle back out the bottom and then closing the pin flap though, it seems like that gives a chance for the top pin to hang up on the bottom pin on the way out the bottom if the pin flap doesn't come open. Head down especially.

I was think you could run it out the top still and then close the pin flap and run it down the outside of the closed container, but that leaves it able to hang up on things while climbing and shit.

Hopefully people give more insight into this and how they do it cause I like the idea of having the top of the container open first.

The timing between top and bottom pin extraction is so slight, it would not matter if the top or bottom opens first. The only advantage for routing it out the top would be for bridle control.

I have been messin with this for years and now feel compelled to write about it. The only benefit of the reverse rigging is less bridle floppin in the wind. If you are last off, it is a pain in the ass to give your self a tuck. This is why I started doing it. Plus, you should never trust your friends to give you a tuck or anything else (or at least my friends)! I route the bridle back down the inside of the cover so there is no snag point for the climb. When I get ready I open my flap so the bridle goes from the top pin to my hand.
I have since quit doing this. Instead I now rig the bridle the standard way, open the cover, and pop the bottom pin. This accomplishes the same effect plus, it makes me "feel" better. I quit using my chickens for sacrifice and now use them for the "Chicken Assist."
Bottom line is it really makes no difference. Its all personal preference. I Have never seen or heard of the bridle snagging under the corners of the rig.

Crikey! - you won't find me at the top of an 'A' on a windy night with my bottom pin 'popped'... Imagine if you managed to pop the top pin on the climb out

I tried the reverse bridle thing a couple of nights ago, it worked very well and did make the bridle much easier to handle. It's definately slightly more preferable for handheld, especially for solo's, but I don't think I'd be comfortable soloing like that unless I was very familiar with it so I guess I keep with it for a bit and see how it goes....

You wont find me doing that if it windy either! I take that back. There is video floating around on the Discovery channel I saw recently. Dunno how it got there. Still waiting on my mo-fo movie check!

I have; a friend of mine, on a low bridge too; very scary!