Basejumper.com - archive

Hey, all!
I've been lurking for a few months now so I'll call this my introduction as well!

I've been jumping a container I bought with my buddy's Mojo280 and his PCs. He obviously needs his gear at some point so, I gotta start rackin' up my supply!! I bought a 46 off of him for lower stuff.

My question is what would you get 1st if you could only afford 1 pc at this time??

I guess the options are between 38" & 42".
What are the limitations (range) of the 2 sizes??
Any info is greatly appreciated, and I feel lucky to have knowledgable peeps to into this sport!

Thanks
Frijol Saltando

p.s. Eventually I'll have a nice supply i.e. right tool for the job.

What do you plan on jumping?

Clickizzle

42'' vented ZP is pretty much your best bet for 2-4.5 sec delays. I finally got to use my 48'' ZP for a go and throw from a low freestander and it worked great, your 46'' will work well for 0-2 sec delays. I choose a 48'' due to the size/weight of my canopy (293 with extra material used for the huge Flik logo on the bottom skin)

I do have the chart printed out.
But I get varying opinions regarding that.
The chart says, 42 is NOT reccomended for over a 4-6 second delay however, I've seen this setup used for exactly that situation (myself included- was that stupid??) Obviously it worked but was I at danger there?

I'd say locally would be A's and my newbie ass only has access to one of them But I do want to get out to Moab once I've built up some experience since it's only 7hr drive from here.

Also from the A I've jumped there's a great halfway point ~450'

So, to answer your question it will typically be 450' to 930'. so 2-5-ish second delay.

Thanks guys!

Thanks I didn't catch that before I posted again. . .

It's 7 hrs if you take a nap on the way, we'll do it in 5.5-6 max!

By using that chart you will maximize the life of your gear. If you're using a 42 for long delays, you're increasing the chances of gear failure. At 4 seconds, a 38 works very nice.

Get your 42 for now...but bring a 46 when you get around to trying Moab.

And do your homework. There's a level of experience in Moab that is futile to try and quantify. Always good to pick their brains long before you even make the trip.

Have fun. Be Meticulous.

42 inch Toxic from Asylum. 250' go and throws to 4-5 second slider ups. spendy but sweet.

Check out Brandon at Badseedbase.com. He makes sweet gear at reasonable prices.

not really answering your question...

I'd say retire from BASE until you get the money. pilot chutes are cheap. you can even buy them used. if you can't afford a pc, can you afford:

- a 7 hour car trip?
- places to sleep?
- beer?
- an injury?

this is not a good sport to attempt with little funds. yes, people do it.

do what you feel is best.

wwarped. The part I agree with is the injury part. Beyond that, did you always have enough money to get as much gear as you want? Things have a way of working themselves out. Choosing between spending money on a few pilot chutes or the floor at a hotel for a couple days, the floor wins.

The rest of the answer: Given my location, I'd suggest the 42 with 46 coming in second.

I agree, living in the USA,
first a 42", second a 46",
and third a 38" then you
are pretty set for a while.

Keep in mind the 4000'+ elevation you're going to be dealing with between the city, Moab, and Twin Falls. And the 280 sqft is pretty big and heavy.

Just to confirm my own
understanding and make
it clear for any newbies...

The higher field elevations,
on average, have lower air
density hence larger PC's
are needed.

Bigger parachutes, and ones
with vents, weigh more and
hence need larger PC's also.

All correct sir?

Thanks guys!
Goin' with a 42" maybe Toxic but if not, lookin' at the AV.

Don't worry NOT going to Moab until at least a trip or two to the Bridge and whatever else peeps around here recommend for prep. I just threw that out there because given, my location and my LOVE for Indian Creek splitters, that would be the closest logical place I can think of.

wwarped. . . good job (aerospace), good insurance, live in my truck, BAD CREDIT. If I could whip that shit out on a card I'd have what I need but, cash only for this cat. It's good for me, I have to save to get what I want!! I know if really friggin' want it if it's expensive and I sacrifice for it. . .
Feel like I'm justifying myself now. . .

But to answer your question . . .Yes, I can afford a trip to wherever I want to go with a little planning.
Yes, IF I want to sleep in a hotel I can but, that's what my trucks for. . .and friends' floors.
Beer? Frequently.
Can I afford an injury? Really, who CAN? But If it happens I "should" be covered.

The problem isn't affording it, it's affording it after the holiday season, and a couple of other factors that put me back this pay period. He needs his gear, I need a pilot chute. I'm asking opinions on what to BUY.

WOW, I'm outta breath now!! Sorry for the long post but thanks for all the advice!!

42" here I come!!

SirVato

Got there in 5.5 when I had my STI!! Jackson Hole just over 6hrs

glad to hear about the insurance. that really is the biggie. it helps demonstrate a measure of responsibility. heck, what community would want to open up an object if injured jumpers can't pay hospital bills?

did you read the recent post by 460? he mentioned being sidelined by injuries for a year, still in debt, and he also works in aerospace...

stay safe.
have fun.

I understand and agree to a large extent.

but I've also watched a newbie bust himself up real bad. he brainlocked from nerves and had a poor choice of equipment for that particular jump. his job should have permitted him to buy much better gear. he ended up spending far more on the insurance deductible.

too many injuries could have been lessened or prevented by upgrading rigs, helmets, body armor, etc. people choosing to enter the sport at the lowest price point should realize they are accepting more risk and should select jumps accordingly.

so, I'm saying, it doesn't always work out...

Uh, wrong!?!?
I live in the USA , and your order doessn't make sense to "Me" friend?


Let's say one lives in a town such as Fresno or Stockton , Ca.???? Or lives in Bakersfield and doesn't mind driving 5 hours north? Etc

32"or 34" big mesh used often, 36" and 38"(s) used a bunch aswell.

Lots of 42 action as well. Some 46 as well but not realy my thing anymore i'm into bigger delay's so the "42" ain't much my bag these day's either.

So mr. Green...... Your order , is your order. And I would think living in Florida a smaller pc would be your first choice living in such flat state ;-)!?!?

Yeah.

Was gonna PM you but can't friend.

Sure dude, longer delays mean more
airspeed & hence smaller pilot chutes.

My highest jumps so far have been BD.
Sure, there are terminal antennas in my
flat state, but between injured legs and
the other things in my life (wife, 2 jobs)
I seldom have the time or inclination to
spend hours and hours climbing...

Hell, on my last jump the other 2 guys
had to push me to get to 590, I was
wanting to jump by the time I hit 400.

it makes sense to have all the different pilot chute sizes but for me and my base jumping career I only have two pilot chute sizes (46 and 38). Its worked well for my 200 something jumps from a sub 250 freefalls to 1000 plus antennas.

I've used 46 from 0-4 delays and 38 from 4-terminal. Its been working good for me and my friends.

Withall due respect mr. Green.

I respnded because the original poster was asking a question about an all around PC. You answer/statement didn't really make sense for everybody.

I have personally been on loads where guys with a decent skydiving background were doing first jumps from terminal stuff "in the USA".

And because of some of their local living rangements continued to only jump the higher/safer terminal stuff.

And on a side note and personal opinion: the toxic PC's are extremely well built PC's but not really needed for a first Pc. You can get 2 PC's for the price of one Toxic. So like the other poster said you can at least use 2 Pc's if need be. If that's the case I would use a large mesh vented ZP 42 and a large mesh 36 or 38 ZP vented. But that's just my opinion on what I'd use.

Lots a luck.

Oh yeah,

For almost the last two years I've exclusively used only my 32 and 36 and on occaison used the 38.

And recently thought about only using a 34 large mesh vented for everything. Wingsuit , tracking , big A's etc.

Yeah , who cares?

Can we wrap this up by agreeing to the following"

The size of the PC depends on a number of things- delay, elevation, temperature, size of the canopy, etc. The shorter delay, warmer temps, bigger canopies, would err to the side of a bigger PC. In general.

The order that you can buy PCs depends if you live next to a 2000'A, or don't have anything around other than a 275' freestander.

But, all things being equal and perfect,
0-1.5s 46/48
1-3.5s 42
3.5-7s 36/38
7+s 32

I never take off my sliders, so my rule of thumb is that if it has the PVC hackey on it, its slider up. Pud style, its slider down. Never get confused with that. I had to deal with 5000'+ elevations and a 280sqft, so slider downs get either a 48 for short delays, or a 42 for the "not too low". If it was above 650' or so (A), it was slider up, 38", up to about 1000', or 6 seconds. Above that, 7+ seconds, the 32 worked great.

The way I've always thought about it was that I think you can pull that stuff out way too quickly, tearing the pack job out too violently. I know there have been discussions about it, but, its one of those things that you do because it makes you feel better at the exit point. However, a 42 works well in most situations also. You wouldn't want to tie a 32" PC to your arm and stick it out of the car window at 30mph, and you would have to get to bridle stretch at two seconds, (pitching at maybe 1 second) to replicate that.

Its just BASE...

bravo... to the most useful post in the thread.

now that this thread has gone on awhile...

if you had looked in the Articles section of this site, you'll find some thoughts on the subject. the specific article is here.

some might modify that advice slightly and you need to customize it yourself. so much depends on the objects you'll jump, and the opening characteristics of your parachute. the latter will depend on the make, age, size, etc.

it boils down to one concept.
BASE tends to be a personal adventure where you find your own truths through experience. it rarely is about what is "right" anymore (thanks to great equipment). it has become about what is "right for you."

how could anyone here know what's best for you? the sport is full of times when you just got to throw a dart, and see how it turns out... research, study, and calculations will help greatly, but eventually you must test your personal theory. and be prepared for when your theory fails - the risk management aspect.

the 32 is a skydiving PC size.


terminal tracking, 36"
more than 3sec up to terminal, and wingsuit 38"
0-4 slider up 42"
0-4 slider down 42"
0-2 slider down 46"
static line, PCA 46"

[this is for a 260 canopy. ]
I don't think a 48 should be used on anything less than a 300' canopy.

I would disagree respectfuly with calvin19 that the 32 zp vented big mesh of is a skydivers tool. Used it and seen used in Switzerland and such with no problems.

Have used countless times at various terminal locations internationaly and domestic.

I believe some pretty famous wingsuiters have been using a 32&34 zp vented big mesh pc for wingsuiring. Maybe they can chime in without me name dropping them???

I guess this thread went a different direction? Maybe a good thing?

if its a small trango a 34 would maybe be acceptable
if not a trango i too won't use anything smaller than a 36.
base gear works better when it is extracted faster, my humble opinion.
plus, as one aussie jumper once said to me--when you find yourself really really low that 38 might just save your life.

Does mentoring not exist anymore? Are the newbs just asking questions on bj.com about what PC to use, and hucking from there?

My previous post was merely a suggestion. Nobody was posting anything technically informative, but there were several petty arguments that were worth reading...

What is the difference between tracking off a 2000' A, or jumping from a small aircraft at 2000' and 35 KIAS?

I always "skydive" to practice for BASE, including tracking openings. The pilot chute and canopy don't care what you jumped out of or off of after 7+ seconds.

And wingsuits are an entirely story. If you are looking for advice on what PC to use for a wingsuit on bj.com, you have bigger problems.

Edited to say that the wiki article that wwarped is pretty good too.

Always be "safe" when you jump...

I would use a 32" if I was getting out of the quick at 2000' agl, and it was the only PC around. other than that, 36 or bigger. if i was still jumping the 222 dagger, I would use a 34 for super terminal tracks.

the difference between tracking off a 2000' cliff and falling out of an airplane at 2000' is heading matters off the cliff, extraction speed matters, and even out of the quick at 2k I like to go low [ish]. a 36 not only extracts faster, but more reliably faster. I used a 32 for a ton of my early jumps, and once I switched to the 36/38, I cannot go back. just like I never will go back with vented canopies. BASE canopies/single parachute systems are supposed to open fast and snappy. at least my opinion.

this, like you said, is only my opinion. I experimented with it all, jumping 42" terminal, and short delay 32", and most other combos in between. the 32 at terminal still feels mushy to me. I think the 36 is the smallest I would want to go at full speed safely.