Basejumper.com - archive

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BSBD

BSBD
~Jake

 
RIP Papy...

Wow...RIP

Didn't realize it was him.

~Jake

If thats the Papy who on skydivingmovies.com has showed how BASE shouldnt be done,then i feel relifed on the behalf of the Belgium crew..

Sorry if thats the same Papy then he were a acsident waiting to die,he were told manytimes.

I´m not writing this to show the dead disrespect but i never meet a person in BASE that wouldnt listen..

Atleast i hope the people arround him(his regular staff that got taught by Papy) realice that BASE is more than a game..

Sorry if im on the wrong person,but i doubt..

Of course it is never good if somebody goes in. However, several people from Belgium told me Papy was doing extreme stuff to say the least. I have jumped this bridge myself hand held and had a 6 seconds canopy ride. Papy has jumped it BOC. If you have just a slight PC inflation delay, there you go. (that is not to say that I claim he jumped it BOC on this particular jump)

Ronald

oh:(
papy
bs...

I enjoyed his videos.

I will miss them! . Sure wasn't a conservative pussy jumper like some of us!

BSBD!

Theres a big difference from pushing the limits while thinking about it,than just playing jack ass..

I know who i think is most cool.. but now again im not the jack ass type..

When did this sport be a contest on who can do the most freaky stuff?
I mean by the end of the day most of us just want to have fun,hopefully arround loads of freinds..

Ive lost my share of freinds the past years,im choosing people to speak whith from if i think they will survive..
If people cant take warnings inkluding experienced jumpers,then they will die,now to me thats a stupied reasson to die..

Im sorry to thouse who lost a freind. But just spoke to a Belgium crew i know for fact that Papy got warnned 1 year ago,as this jumper told him to relaxe or he would be dead whith in 08..Personaly i warned him by PM´s but were told that a pussy as i should shut up..

Now we dont have any rules in BASE and lets keep it that way,but its sad to see as the family grows bigger the selfregulating is falling apart.. By the end of the day stuff like this gives BASE a bad reputation and more people will die..

So how do we prevent death like this in the future?
Personaly i think theres a big difference here from other lowpull fatalityes.

Just my oppinion flame away

Are you guys sure it was papy...has it been confirmed it was him yet?

oh... as I can see - yes...
Cloudsbutterfly posted on skydivingmovies.com:

blue sky again...
as for me this man wasn't a "stupid ass freak"... he was just a man that knows that he will die and accepted it for his own reasons.

Yes it were Papy
he were warned serval times both on skydivingmovies.com pm´s and up front by locals that he should chill.

And yes im sad to say that i dont respect Papy,as he made fun of thouse who tried to help him out..

I have often been agressive to red bull guys like miles and and Shane,as i think they some time go too far. i did the same to Papy,only difference is that the red bull guys has the experience to pull some stuff off,from some of their(papy and couldbutterfly) videos you could say it were more yahoo and burning objects than anywere else..

Hurting the lifestyle of BASE will never get my respect..no matter if your a pro or newbie,and i let people know what i think.Like it or not thats me..

To get this back on track so Papy´s death might could be usefull,has any inspected the gear to clear if it were a lowpull,mailfunkition,hessitation or other that caused this fatality?

Anyway he's gone. I met him one time in swizzerland and now I just can say: my deepest condolences to his family and friends.

Pascal

I agree with Faber to a point....on some of his posted movies, Papy did seem to be cutting his safety margins a little fine....as I looked at it anyhow.
That said...he was a grown man, responsible for his own jumping decisions and choices...and maybe that's just the way he wanted to do his jumps.
He came across to me as being a really nice bloke with an infectious appetite for jumping, a little quirky , a little crazy perhaps ... but in a good way !
...and I'm sure gonna miss not seeing his latest video updates on skydivingmovies.

BSBD Papy

First I’m sorry even I didn’t know the guy. As he has worn a rig he didn’t die intentionally. So something must have gone different to his plans.

Still, to keep the spirit of this forum we may should refer to its basic idea. So is there something to learn out of this incident? Did he jump alone? Do we here just have a(nother) human error or do we face a technical issue we may all should know about?

We all know that BASE can be a life threatening activity. So don’t be shocked when it happens. And please stop senseless discussions after some of our fellows has lived his freedom to the max. That’s what we all stand for.

Just look in the mirror and try yourself next time while you are on stage to be even more responsible towards the image and community of BASE. The sport will appreciate it.

I’ll keep listening if there will be any useful conclusion on this fatal accident.

M.

Sad thing...
Beside of his style of jumping, he was a funny guy.

Condolenses, especially to Cloudsbutterfly.
Stay strong Dude!

"And please stop senseless discussions after some of our fellows has lived his freedom to the max"

The whole idea to live your life to max, is also to survive, and tell the stories when you get older!

This is not true for everyone... If you check the list you will find more then one whos main goal was not triying to survive in the sport. Some people decide to go hard knowing the possible outcome of it. This is a very personal decision. BASE jumping in the public opinion is already suicidal and in my opinion it is not on us to judge the ones who are taking more risks then others. We can decide not to jump with then and stay away from them...

Sorry, I should said "my idea of living my life to the maximum, is to survive, and tell stories when I get old"

Your true,but is BASEjumping for suricide persons?
I hope not,i´ll stay away as far as i can from thouse kind of persons,i have no whish to see dead frinds..

Having 4 kids totaly,i speak from my own that BASE to me is about LIFE and not death,ofcourse it happens,but i hope to die as a oldguy not from BASE but becourse im old..If people want to kill them self theres more easy ways to do so than strap on BASEgear and jump.. just simply dont use the gear..

That said i dont think Papy wanted to die,i think he were having fun,just in a way that others and i dont agree whith.. Its a fact that some people dont care about traditions,codecs etc etc when your a person living by thouse "rules" then it harms you when you see objects you know are sencitive getting dayblazed..

What harms me about Papy and Cloudsbutterfly is that they were making fun at people who tried to help and warn them about dangers that were easy to see in their videos..They did so serval times not only online but also offline were really experienced jumpers warned them...

Im my litel personal world i listen to ANY input about me or my gear,i then considder if im right or wrong,i dont care if its a newbie or a rokie telling me stuff,i just need to take it to me as i cant afford to die if i can avoid it..

Still i would like to know if the fatality were from a lowpull,pc hesitation or other malfunktion on the gear.

No, we are all not suicidal.
BASE is of course our way to show that we are alive.

The point is, that even if we feel and do everything a hundred percent right, we still can die. Look at Lukas Knutsson (see attachment).

You have no bonus to any jump because you thought more about it than others or behaved in a special ethic way. It is all about what you personaly may need to feel better while acting in such a dangerous field like BASE.
And BASE is far away from obeying anyone. And to increase this, a mountain, a bridge etc. does not know that you prepared yourself for it.
Only your decisions and your skills may lead you along a harmless path.

Ignorance is only that long a bless as long as you think that the elements will follow. An those who keep the faith in luck may face disappointment one day.

Hopefully there is always a jump ahead of us ...
M.

After 30 accidents of friends, people I knew, or met in basejumping, it is only two who had an unfortenly accident one in a millon type. The rest pushed it to far! Simple as that!

this is NOT necessarily true. far too many people BASE to make such a generalization. different people jump for different reasons.


yes, death always is possible, but at what odds?
10:1?
100:1?
1000:1?
10000:1?

it sounds like people warned him against high risk jumping.
he may have accepted his jumping as risky without much concern for the level of risk.

like Faber, I would like to know more details. many evidently disagreed with his judgment, thus assume bad judgment caused this fatality. much of what has been said may be wrong if he suffered a gear problem.

no matter what the cause, his family and friends still suffer...

Yes, family always suffer. And this is sad. So everyone can decide here to stop BASE before he leads anyone to suffer.

So even if we pretend to accept all consequences, we may not accept to receive them all.

And as we see our world thru our own eyes, we always believe we are a hundred percent right.
But who knows how big the gap is between what we know and what we might should know.
In this case the guy may thought everything is in control. But obviously something was not.

To go for relativ mathematics: I am sure BASE does not follow human statistics.
Of course there are different jumps with different quality requirements out there. And as nothing is perfect, mistakes can happen to all of us.
It is therefore more a matter of who is doing what. And some do things they should not do. Or they accept conditions which they can not control. Or maybe they just have pushed their luck to far.

But still I do not agree to assume that there are any suicidals among us.
Indeed there is a lot of ego out there. And some of us need to push the limits to feel even more recognized than others.
So what, this is just human nature. Some of us abuse BASE for this. These guys sometimes say and do things just to fit into a desired image. It is our decision to honor or ignore them.
But deep in the heart we all do not want to die while BASE jumping.
Even if it can happen. And if you die instanly you are a lucky buddy.

Again, I am sorry for Papy but I am sure he wished to live this way.
Apart from that I appreciate this exchange here.
M.

Look at BASE as russian rulette.We all acsept the posibility that we might die on the next jump,BUT how do you play the game?
1 bullet in the revolver = 1/6 chance to die
3 bullets in the revolver = 50/50 chance to die
now what happens if you use an automatic?
We all know..

The sad thing is that I think that Papy(even throug many warnings)didnt knew how dangerus he played the game,he taught Cloudsbutterfly the same..

Only facts will tell if Papy played the game too hard,or if it were gear mailfunktion.I hope we get them one day.

Yes you are right. It is a matter of how we play the game.
But do not blame others that you are satisfied at a lower risk level. Be happy that you survived all your plans yet and enjoy it.

I do.

Still I agree that our community needs to work on the collective responsibility towards our habits.
We are not alone and so we do not have the freedom to burn objects or base our BASE life on recklessness no matter what happens.
We are even more responsible to accept the existing experiences out there by not trying to invent the wheel new.
Better be thankfull that you can be part of all that. So to say we are all blessed individuals to be able to join such a sport.

Still humans are pushing limits. If we were not genetict this way we may would still sit in caves and do drawings to the walls.

But during new challenges it is all a matter of judgement, too.
I do not know if Papy was up to a new challenge but just did a poor performance or bad judgement or thought his skills are bigger than needed.

Still there are no infos available.
Look at the french guy who died last beginning year. If he would not have jumped alone he would have had a friend who called the paramedics. So he did not bleed to death.
Look at the guy who twisted his bridle around the legstrap. If someone would have checked the gear he would be still alive.
Look at the guy who missed to knot his PC ... look at the guy who lost the stowed PC on pull and so his regrip was to late ... look at the PC who was in bad shape and failed to work properly ... look at the hestitation of the Pin due to too much packing pressure ... look at the bridlewrapp around the arm which delayed the opening ... look ...

I am OK if Papy just pulled to low or to late or if the PC or opening just hesitated as they sometimes do.
It's maybe just to know that a xy feet bridge with a (maybe) stowed xy PC and a xx seconds delay is beyond the limits.
But if he had a PC entaglement or had one beer too many or tried a bad performed aerial whilst pulling it would be nice to know also.

And actually I think I know what is beyond the limits for me. But who knows how big my gap is.
At least it is an open forum to gain information and so I hope this thread is shared to whom it may concern.

M.

Maybe this topic should be split. Personal reasons of pushing the limits within the terms of each person is so different. This thread is about Papy and his last and final jump. I think this thread should be about that, the one last thing he did.

Read closer. It is all about his last thing he did.

But do not make this forum or thread only a condolence book.
Actually it should not be this at all even everyone is free to share his feelings.

M.

well, if you expect from community to set us up -forget it! They will do that in only one way - STOP!
See under USA....


really?! So who will set the rules?! Red Bull?!


U sound like a pope in 15th century here. It is all about seeking for different and new. Some are more productive and more lucky doing this than others...


It is much more simple than this. Statistics is called this. Playing w low pulls for to long , known outcome is there...


every year in Adriatic sea in Croatia there is about 40 scuba divers finish their life under , swimming and diving forever. ( 90% are from Czech republic though)
They all know that rules are there to be followed but... Shell they ban scuba diving?!

That French guy new the risk. We all know the risk. We have to learn from it. That is the max we can and have to do around such thing.


Mahle, this is what BASE is!! Risky game. requires skill and maturity. Do not try to make BASE idiot proof sport because soon , we will start wearing two AADs

Dude whats up ...
Of course I love somehow your more direct stile but all my relpies came up in order.

Actually I just wanted to know what happened exactly while I disagreed the judging of others before they new any details.

And insted of PM somebody I did it public because I thought some people may listen.

But now it reached for sure a road split and so we need to leave Papys thread to respect his idea of BASE.

M.

well that sounds like Papy on top of pulling things off way above his experience level..

Well i only cared as i tried to be freindly to the guy surgesting to slow down.it wasnt my objects.. but be sure ,if a person arround my neck of woods had the same "problem" he would soo be out of jumping buissness.. Call me a theif or selfregulater i dont really care..I´ll punch the person in the face and take the rig..
I worked to open the objects arround here,i still work whith neigbours to objects,people inside places etc etc and i wont allow a person to ruin my fun just becourse he/she after serval warnings wont take more care to them self and the objects..
Im not to deside if you gonna push the limits arround me,but if you´r attemting somthing that i think is far out,atleast i demand the respect that i warned you,dont make me look like a fool becourse i cared about you..
Oh yeah im not a saint aswell,i broke my leg 2 times off the same object,i were bustede there once whith a Belgium guy and 2 Aussie,and guess what,.. my work on that object makes it still stand 900ft Daytime jump.. hell yeah im gonna kick ass if some one wont respect the rules out there,letting me look stupied towards the people who for more than 6 years has let us jump off this place daytime,no matter if there were injuryes or police at the site...

If people first dont follow the agreements(as theres no rules,besides try not to die or get hurt),AND jumping in a way that by near time WILL be a acsident.. oh well

What happened to the respect,codecs and selfregulating in BASE?
Could this fatality have been prevented or were it another unluckyday fatalityes?

No matter,each time my wife step up and defends me and my way of life through BASE,it makes it harder to her to agum that it aint stupied..
Its harder to Legal places to keep them legal if the wrong people apper all the time..

Or did BASE just turn modern and i became a rokie too old and twisted?

One day you where young and fresh to the sport, and you almost killed yourselves several times? Some need to experience for themselves, and the sport do need people who hurt and kill themselves! I say this because they stop others from doing the same mistakes. For every life gone in base it saves 10?

I had huge respect for base before i got my chance to do one myselves, since we had huge news of all the rescues in Troll Wall, and my only hero in my life died there!

I had a look at Papy´s video on skydivingmovies, and he seemed to be a happy guy playing a game he did not fully understand the outcome of! If he dont care about himselves, he should care about his surraundings!

yes i did,i didnt say i were smart,and it nearly costed my life,since then.. ive learned alot trust me ;-P

edit: i nearly killed myself once,not serval times

The jump with Spiderman? The word abou the crazy dane come across the fjord ;-)

Not to be a dickhead, but I believe that every newcomer cocky motherfucker who starts basejumping hard and progressing beyond that is of human capacity deserves an accident, no...not a fatal one by god...maybe a broken ankle, bad strain, something that will set their ass down for a month or two to think that we are homo sapien, double stranded dna, fragile with respect to gravity and earth which is mostly rock...It helped me, busted up bad in colorado jumping in a level 2 thunderstorm, remote, high altitude, but with it being my last day of vacationj....I said "fuck it". I'll never repeat that mistake again...