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1400ft antenna vs. 500ft bridge on your first jump?
What are the benefits to jumping a high antenna, over a lower bridge for your 1st base jump?
I have 600+ skydives, so feel comfortable with my track.
I know a bridge is apparently the safest, especially with a PCA, a very low risk jump...but there must be some benefits to jumping the antenna.
Any input appreciated...thanks.
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Re: [Kynan1] 1400ft antenna vs. 500ft bridge on your first jump?
dont mind me

but do bothWinkWink
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Re: [Kynan1] 1400ft antenna vs. 500ft bridge on your first jump?
many different factors are involved. describe both objects in more detail.
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Re: [Kynan1] 1400ft antenna vs. 500ft bridge on your first jump?
Kynan1 wrote:
What are the benefits to jumping a high antenna


you could pull a "two-second-tony" and get hung up 1200ft in the air...
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Re: [AndrewKarnowski] 1400ft antenna vs. 500ft bridge on your first jump?
Climbing a 1400' A suck's balls. But it's fun to take the quick way down.
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Re: [AndrewKarnowski] 1400ft antenna vs. 500ft bridge on your first jump?
AndrewKarnowski wrote:
Kynan1 wrote:
What are the benefits to jumping a high antenna


you could pull a "two-second-tony" and get hung up 1200ft in the air...

you could also do a 1-second-catcus mary...but the 2-second tony gives you a safer out.
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Re: [Calvin19] 1400ft antenna vs. 500ft bridge on your first jump?
Calvin19 wrote:
many different factors are involved. describe both objects in more detail.
The Perrine Bridge and the antenna by Vegas.
Landing area is better at the bridge too. I'd just like to get a few opinions on it.
I know the antenna has guide wires of course, so that's a factor.
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Re: [Kynan1] 1400ft antenna vs. 500ft bridge on your first jump?
Site naming not the best on here. I think they meant more about what the wire situation at the antennae is. Antennaes are more fun in my opinion, but itll scare you shitless for your first jump, and id bet you pull high. Either one will be bad ass, just pick what you feel more comfortable with for a first jump, and do the other later.
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Re: [Kynan1] 1400ft antenna vs. 500ft bridge on your first jump?
probably not the best idea, but my second and third jump were from a 2000ft A. as long as you aren't a pussy and you're jumping in the right conditions...

what could possibly go wrong?Smile
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Re: [AndrewKarnowski] 1400ft antenna vs. 500ft bridge on your first jump?
In reply to:
you could pull a "two-second-tony" and get hung up 1200ft in the air...

Or you could have a nice on heading opening and have plenty of hang time to pick out the perfect spot to land...
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1400ft antenna vs. 500ft bridge
Just my 3 cents Smile

A big consideration in my mind would your
gear configuration!

The former is a slider up jump and the later is
a slider off jump. I only have 2 slider up jumps
so this is not based on personal experience...
BUT people I respect with lots of BASE jumps
told me that slider up is a lot less idiot proof.

Plus if you are packed for slider up and hose
the exit and need to open early for some
reason then you are in a situation where you
are dumping a slider up pack job with a short
delay next to an object.

Oh, and from personal experience I can tell
you that climbing when scared makes your
arms overly tense which slows you down.
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Re: [Kynan1] 1400ft antenna vs. 500ft bridge on your first jump?
Bust Factor.

At the Perrine, we have the one place where you can literally sit at exit ALL DAY LONG with no fear of anything but environment or yourself changing. At any antenna you have the very real danger of being seen, called in, and putting yourself into a place of having to weigh personal safety against legal liability.
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Re: [Kynan1] 1400ft antenna vs. 500ft bridge on your first jump?
Kynan1 wrote:
I know the antenna has guide wires of course, so that's a factor.

They're GUY wires!

Do some more reading and research, start hanging out with jumpers, or take a first jump course.

The bridge has many less variables, and not just because it doesn't have wires.
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Re: [tfelber] 1400ft antenna vs. 500ft bridge on your first jump?
tfelber wrote:
In reply to:
you could pull a "two-second-tony" and get hung up 1200ft in the air...

Or you could have a nice on heading opening and have plenty of hang time to pick out the perfect spot to land...


yea... that did sound kinda off....

I meant to say you could take a 2 second delay, and have an off heading into the tower.

unlike tony who had the ninja-like skills to pull of that maneuver unscathed.
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Re: [Kynan1] 1400ft antenna vs. 500ft bridge on your first jump?
can you do it? is there any chance in your head that you will freak out and only take 2 second delay from the tower? or can you FOR SURE take a solid delay and deal with it?
do your close friends think you can do it? if there is ANY DOUBT in your head that you can push off of something with a clear head and do what needs to be done, I would go to the bridge. but if your solid, and have that knack for new scary things, go for it.
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Re: [Kynan1] 1400ft antenna vs. 500ft bridge on your first jump?
Kynan1 wrote:
What are the benefits to jumping a high antenna, over a lower bridge for your 1st base jump?

None because you have to spend the extra altitude getting away from the object and have guy wires to deal with.

In reply to:
I have 600+ skydives, so feel comfortable with my track.

But have very few zero airspeed exits and very little experience starting to track at less than cessna exit speeds.
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Re: [Kynan1] 1400ft antenna vs. 500ft bridge on your first jump?
How often do you freeclimb a 1400ft antenna/ladder ?(Ok it could have a part with an elavator/grades)

....and then freefall, PC throwing, handling a big canopy near ground for the first time with tired arms?
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Re: [Kynan1] 1400ft antenna vs. 500ft bridge on your first jump?
>>I have 600+ skydives, so feel comfortable with my track.<<

You have exactly the same amount of skydives that I did when I began BASE jumping.

And while the 600 skydives I made were varied as in lots of different places with lots of different gear I thought the transition to BASE would be smooth and manageable. But it wasn't. My first BASE jump was a lot like my first S/L skydive. A big blur of motion, color, and speed and I was behind the curve the entire jump.

Taking into consideration we are all different (to a degree), and I've seen others take to BASE. quite easily; it would still be foolish not to plan for the worst. The Cosmos doesn't know, or care, if you are making your first BASE jump or your thousandth BASE jump when it decides to throw you a curve ball.

I've said in the past we are luckier today as there is such a wealth of BASE information and experience available for new jumpers. But that has now become a bit of double edged sword. There is so much information to digest it's become quite possible to pick the wrong things to focus on. You didn't say anything about having a mentor, so I'll assume you have one. And it's their job to keep you laser beamed onto the important stuff.

More to the point a first BASE jump from a tall tower is not a good idea. And here are some things to consider. Again I'll assume you understand the basics like what combination of wind in relation to the wires would call for aborting the jump. Also towers of this height have multiple levels of wires so there are at least two altitudes where opening would but you in a corner with the tower behind you and wires to your left and right. You mentioned confidence in your tracking, and yes that skill will negate the above somewhat, but how many times have you transitioned to a track in subterminal air? Tracking away from a terminal skydive is not the same as tracking away from a tower after only a few seconds of freefall. We make it look easy on Youtube – but nobody is born knowing how to do that.

Another thing to consider is your state of mind. Upboard someone mentioned the bust factor on a tower and that is really good point. In your case it could go one of two ways and both are bad. You will either focus on it too much to the detriment of doing well on the jump, or you won't care at all, and possibly burn a good object.

And if you are lucky enough to have a mentor who correctly steers you through that part are you climbing or riding? If there's an elevator you're fortunate, but if you have to climb it will mess with your head. Just climbing a 1400-foot steel ladder without jumping is a big enough deal on its own. Again we are all different, but for most people at 100-feet you'll still be excited. At 500 feet you'll be thinking, "WTF am I doing?" And at 1000-feet you'll be a quivering mass of jelly.

All antenna towers pose some amount of radiation risk. AM towers are the worst, of course, but FM, TV, and microwave towers all spew out electro magnetic radiation. Some people are more susceptible to it than others. And I'm only throwing it in here to make sure you consider that part of the overall risk. On any live tower the best advice is, get on – get up –and get off - as fast as possible. But that's exactly the kind of pressure you don't need on a first BASE jump. Also, I'll assume this to be a night jump. How many of those have you done? And night skydives and night BASE jumps are two different things.

Now let's look at the relative dangers between all types of objects. We live in a time when if a BASE number isn't important to you, than you could have a very respectable career in B.A.S.E. without ever going near a building or tower. And even if you want a BASE number starting on the "softer" objects makes more sense. Cliffs can offer the same, or more altitude, without the wires, but it's hard to argue against bridges for a first BASE jump.

When I used to mentor people I put more than a few off a tower on their first jumps. There was no potato bridge then, nor any of the legal cliffs. But none of these first jumps were freefalls. At first it was direct bag or static line, and later PCAs. And it wouldn't matter if the new jumper had thousands of skydives. And I don’t see anything that's changed in BASE to make me think differently today. There's a reason there's no first BASE jump course in the world today that doesn't end on a bridge, or in a very few cases a very tall cliff. And even then, at least on the Bridges, these first jumps aren't freefalls.

History has shown us that very few people die on a first BASE jump. And the few that did were woefully unprepared. You don't sound that way so yes, you could probably make this tower jump without incident. But that's not entirely what you should be shooting for. BASE jumping is a lot of fun. Over a lifetime you'll meet a lot of cool people and go on a lot of cool road trips. And when you are sitting in the rocking chair in the old folks home while everyone else is bemoaning their regrets you can pop a DVD in of your past jumps and your palms will get sweaty again and old Miss Betty in the next room might just drop her drawers for you.

But the main thing is if you get hurt bad on one of your first few BASE jumps, then no matter how much you dreamed and drooled over BASE - it's probably over. It's very hard to return from an injury when you are experienced, it's five times as hard when your not. However, if you do get hurt, but it can be said you did everything right and BASE just bit you in the ass, then you have a shot of coming back. What I mean is break a leg at the Potato by sticking your foot in a hole on landing and the entire community will wish you a speedy recovery and welcome you back. But wind up dangling from a wire on your first BASE jump and you'll only hear what an asshole you are from every person who ever strapped on a BASE rig.

NickD Smile
BASE 194
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Re: [DrewEckhardt] 1400ft antenna vs. 500ft bridge on your first jump?
I prefer putting students off of big antennas with strong winds bisecting the wires. With those conditions, it can be almost impossible to hit the tower. A lot of big antennas have great landing areas. Most bridges are over rugged areas. Best altitude in my opinion for an antenna jump is 700 feet or so, configured slider down with a jump delay of 2-3 seconds.
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Re: [460] 1400ft antenna vs. 500ft bridge on your first jump?
Thanks Nick and everyone for their input. I value your opinions. I'm going to speak with my mentor today on the topic and figure it out from there.
I didn't think about the fatigue from a long climb or that their two sets of guide wires. If the first jump is an antenna and I weren't "comfortable", I simply would not jump.
Good points everyone! Anymore input is appreciated.
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Re: [Kynan1] 1400ft antenna vs. 500ft bridge on your first jump?
carry a quickdraw for the climb to clip in on the tower when fatigued, emergencies, or whenever you feel like it.
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Re: [460] 1400ft antenna vs. 500ft bridge on your first jump?
Kind of makes me wonder why a guyed 1000' remote tower, slider-down PCA from 600', is so much more black death than the TF bridge? Especially if you have a competent, heads-up newb that has a ton of balloon jumps.

I did my first 28 in TF, and it was what it was. However, as long as you are patient and understand that a guyed tower is far from a guaranteed jump, I don't see why it isn't as "safe" as TF.

If the winds are medium, perfectly between the wires, at 600' and a rockin' landing area... Why is a PCA there a bad idea?

TF isn't perfect. Bust free? Yes. Bright, stress-free daylight? Yes. But there are still trees, moving water, gopher holes, and rocks. Emergency access isn't easy at the bottom unless the boat is there and waiting, and it isn't always close to home.

Questions, comments?
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Re: [base935] 1400ft antenna vs. 500ft bridge on your first jump?
when i had 600 jumps i thought i new something 2
i was wrong

just free fall some thing sub 200 foot that way theres no time to think about nasty stuff when shit goes bad . it will be over before u can get scared
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Re: [1072] 1400ft antenna vs. 500ft bridge on your first jump?
1072 wrote:

just free fall some thing sub 200 foot that way theres no time to think about nasty stuff when shit goes bad . it will be over before u can get scared
Where's the disclaimer for folks over 200 lbs. ?
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Re: [base935] 1400ft antenna vs. 500ft bridge on your first jump?
base935 wrote:

...

I did my first 28 in TF, and it was what it was. However, as long as you are patient and understand that a guyed tower is far from a guaranteed jump, I don't see why it isn't as "safe" as TF.

...

If the winds are medium, perfectly between the wires, at 600' and a rockin' landing area... Why is a PCA there a bad idea?

...

Questions, comments?


No questions, but a comment... I never have been hung up on the guy wire of a bridge, but with my ninja like skills, it is only a matter of time.Tongue In all seriousness, I think your comment about wind speed is very important is especially important if the jump is a PCA, but any slider down jump.

I think TF is definitely safer if you take the safest conditions at TF vs the safest conditions at an A.
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Re: [Kynan1] 1400ft antenna vs. 500ft bridge on your first jump?
Kynan1 wrote:
What are the benefits to jumping a high antenna, over a lower bridge for your 1st base jump?
I have 600+ skydives, so feel comfortable with my track.
I know a bridge is apparently the safest, especially with a PCA, a very low risk jump...but there must be some benefits to jumping the antenna.
Any input appreciated...thanks.

Face it dude...you're going to fuckin' die either way....but probably more likely on the drive to either site.Laugh

Have fun dude! When my ankle heals...its on!
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Re: [seldomseen_mark] 1400ft antenna vs. 500ft bridge on your first jump?
seldomseen_mark wrote:
AndrewKarnowski wrote:
Kynan1 wrote:
What are the benefits to jumping a high antenna


you could pull a "two-second-tony" and get hung up 1200ft in the air...

you could also do a 1-second-catcus mary...but the 2-second tony gives you a safer out.

the cactus mary is quite a technical move..........it takes at LEAST 20 years BASE experience to master that move..........and the ability to diagnose micrometeorology with your index finger.......
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Re: [Kynan1] 1400ft antenna vs. 500ft bridge on your first jump?
I'd take the bridge, hands down. Much simpler, much safer, and climbing antennas can be a bitch.

Yes, a guyed antenna can be a relatively safe first jump. However, you'd be much better off going for a bridge your first time around.

Also, don't plan on tracking the antenna anytime before your 10th jump (I'd recommend waiting at least til #20). You need to nail your exits first - a skill that's not nearly as easy as it looks. Start with a PCA or two. If your exits look good, switch to a freefall assist or two. Once you have 3-5 kick-ass exits, do one second handheld. Then do 1.5. Then do 2. Then 3. Vary the exits from time to time (sometimes jump from a rail, sometimes standing, sometimes sitting). Only once you know you can nail the exit and be tracking within 2 seconds should you consider going slider up. Slider up on a first jump from an object you can hit is a BAD IDEA.

Choose your exit point on the antenna to maximize your distance from the guy wires. Remember a good PCA will have you inflated and flying just 10-20 meters below the exit point. A freefall assist will have you inflated and flying 25-35 meters below the exit point. Adjust your exit height for the jump.

Disclaimer: I have two years experience and have never jumped a guyed antenna. I have 8 bridge jumps, 24 terminal cliifs, and ~42 slider off object jumps (mostly 100 meter freestanding antennas).
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Re: [inzite] 1400ft antenna vs. 500ft bridge on your first jump?
I have no base experience but I think, presonally, and it may just be me, but for my first jump if I actually made it all the way to the top of the antenna that high I'd probably just sit down and cry. A bridge sounds a lot more fun, for a first jump, than a 1400' antenna, but that's just me.
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Re: [mbondvegas] 1400ft antenna vs. 500ft bridge on your first jump?
typically...
bridge - jump, then hike. might struggle with surging adrenalin.
antenna - climb, then jump. might struggle with fatigue.

legal - no thoughts about getting busted.
less than legal - additional concerns flooding brain.

day - can see hazards and fly parachute accordingly.
night - must know landing area well.

what is best for you?