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Is there any advantage in choosing one of these containers over the other? Will the Heliums slimmer profile and longer container have any effect on short delays jumps?


PS. Have asked the manufacturers. Still waiting on Morpheus.

I've got about 300 jumps on my Gargoyle and a friend of mine with whom I jump pretty regularly has the DP so we've done plenty of comparison between the two. First of all I'd say that they are both outstanding rigs and either one you take, you won't be disappointed. I personally think that the closing flap design on Gargoyle is superior compared to any rig in the market whereas I like DP's shoulder flap design over Gargoyle's. Apart from those differences both rigs are well built, functional and will serve you good. I've yet to see the Helium myself or jump one so cannot give any comments on that one. Hope it helps.

It just bothers me the rig is called the DP. I have lots of funny visions of what could happen on the exit point with that rig. Is it a female rig?

You're comparing two apples and an orange.

The Helium is an ultra light rig. It's made for smoother airflow when tracking and lighter weight. It may be a little less durable, but I don't think we have any real reports from long term helium users on that. It may also be a touch less "cosmetic" (less padding to even out bumps in your pack job) and might be slightly less comfortable if you hang in it for hours (unlikely given the nature of our jumping).


The Gargoyle and the DP are both "standard" rigs. It's much easier to compare the two of them to each other, because they're designed for much the same purpose--as all around BASE rigs.

My experience with them has been that the DP is substantially easier to close, but less "pretty" (meaning the average person makes the closed container look less clean, with more lumpiness), and less aerodynamic (for wingsuits and tracking). The Gargoyle, then, is harder to close, but usually closes looking nicer, and has smoother aerodynamics.

All of the above are good rigs. Which you choose depends on your purposes (for the helium) and jumping style, and your personal preferences (DP v. Gargoyle).

If you're especially cost sensitive, the Gargoyle is slightly less expensive ($750 at retail, v. $810 for the DP, when comparing complete--everything but the canopy--packages).

Keep in mind also that the Gargoyle is significantly heavier than every other BASE container I've ever handled. I suspect that was the impetus for them to put together the Helium.


I don't have a DP, but I have a Vertex2 (almost a predecessor) and I like it a lot better than my Gargoyle.

helium is a improved version of WS X-treme container which is gargoyle with WS mod.
razor is the light container made for new trango canopy only(or really light packing volume canopy) I try to order razor for my troll but Kathy said only the trango well fit so I order helium, I well let you know in few years how it does
if you like gargoyle you should love helium
I saw DP but never use it before, it look nice

I have 2 DP's and love them. Two buddies have a DP and a Gargoyle each as their two rigs, one likes the DP better, the other likes the Gargolye better. Both are excellent containers. It comes down to your personal preference, customer service, and how comfortable you are with the manufacturers answers to all of your questions.

>>It just bothers me the rig is called the DP. I have lots of funny visions of what could happen on the exit point with that rig. Is it a female rig?<<

DP, of course, stands for Dual Pin which was a departure for Todd. Before Apex, and before Basic Research Todd's very first BASE equipment company was called "TNT Rigging" and his first rig was the Velcro closed "Reactor."

I asked him about the sense of naming these things after stuff that can blow up, but TNT actually stood for Todd & Troy, the two brothers who started the company. And they meant Reactor in the sense of "reacting" and not nuclear reactors . . .

Todd's original single pin rig was called, not the SP, but the "Prism" and we stayed up late at night arguing that one. I was suggesting "Evader" but I lost out. Even as early as 1988 Todd was visionary enough to tell me, "Nick, BASE jumping isn’t always going to be illegal."

Naming conventions in BASE are kind of interesting, especially if you look at "the road not taken." When Moe Viletto was looking for a name for his new BASE Company, he first considered "Sewn for Safety" but at the last minute he changed it to "Tailored for Survival." He also named his individual rigs after "cutting" things like "The Edge" and "The Blade." His ParaPak was almost called the "The Double Edge" but that was too much of a mouth full.

Some names seemed really weird when we first heard them, like the "Mojo," and we laughed and thought, "Gee, what's Adam smoking?" But it seems very familiar and correct now.

The cool thing, however, is now jumpers can actually ask, "Which rig is better for what I'm doing?" And they can choose from so many. Especially if you can remember the original "hybrid" BASE rigs. These were the very first BASE rigs. And they where nothing more than old discarded skydiving systems that you picked the stitching out of and removed the container from the harness. Then you sewed a simple four sided Velcro closed BASE container back onto the harness. We used to call those "Frankenstein Rigs." And many early BASE jumpers made there first jumps on Frankies . . .

Later, "Frankie" became a term used to describe newbie BASE jumpers who launched too head high and went vertical. It was because they looked like they were doing the Frankenstein walk in freefall and at early Bridge Days it always raised a chorus of, "Frankie!!!!"

Happy Halloween, Everyone!

NickD
BASE 194

I like both the DP and the Gargoyle but haven't seen a Helium. I've jumped both the DP and the Gargoyle as well as another you might want to consider, the Perigee Pro. It may be more in the same category as the DP and Gargoyle than the helium.

The other posts cover my opinions except that I would say I like the bridle storage flap that is attached to the bottom flap on the gargoyle. On the DP I saw the bridle was shoved between the bottom and side flap. I don't know how likely/possible it is for a snag to occur if the bridle is shoved too far in, but I felt more comfortable with that part of the gargoyle design. All that said, I would gladly accept any of these rigs as a bribe to vouch for their product.

I still have one of Troy and Todd's original TnT BASE rigs, with a cast iron cloud in it.
It hasn't been in the air in almost 10 years, but who knows, maybe a water jump at The Tater will be a good time to bring it out into the light again.

BASE359

>>I still have one of Troy and Todd's original TnT BASE rigs, with a cast iron cloud in it.<<

That sounds like a "natch" for the 50 year old way!

I'm sure the Pick still has a Raven somewheres and I've got a "Frankie" with a Cruselite in it.

Is there room in the boat for all three of us?

NickD
BASE 194

I'm jumping a Razor (prototype) (only Slider-up ), a Gargoyle and a Helium both for slider up and down. The helium is definitely a super nice rig. I can't feel any difference between the Gargoyle and the Helium on slider-down jumps. But on wingsuit or tracking jumps there's a huge difference and I can totally feel the much better airflow of the Helium compared to the Gargoyle.
So if you wanna get a really really nice rig that you can use for EVERY kind of jump, I'd totally recommend the Helium!
Cheers
Jojo

you can thank the irrepressible Gary Cobb for the TfS logo artwork.

Craig

I have a DP I must say for the size canopies they fit they look very slimline and small most people seem to think my rig is smaller than it is. the boc sits quite high much higher than my skydiving rig up my back the harness is very snug and comfy much comfyer than my skydiving rig wich is full articulated my dp is not, and the harness seems to absorb openings well they are firm but never painful or uncomforable unlike my skydiving rig. it seems to put me in a much more sitting back lazy boy position under canopy which i also like.

On the i dont like side of things the over the shoulder riser covers seem very secure and keep the rig semi closed (ecourage the flaps to stay where they are rather than open up once the pins pop and the canopy squeezes through them, seems to undo some of my packing effort and distort the packjob a little and im wondering if it affects the openings in a bad way. the bridal protection from pin to boc is poor and it is possible to tuck your bridal to far and ending up on the wrong side between canopy and flap dont know if this could cause a hangup or not. then again putting a bridal cover wouldnt be to hard and solve all my worries.