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Hi there, I jump a Fox 225. Although I like it's 'mushy' characteristics for placement, because I'm shorter at 5'3", I therefore have shorter arms and legs. I have always found the flare a little tricky because of it. I bought the canopy new back in '99 and haven't put that many jumps on it. The newer style canopies have a fifth line on the tail & therefore a deeper flare.

Has anyone retro-fitted a fifth line on their canopy - what are the pro's and cons? Should I leave it as it is and accept that unless there are few knots of wind I may find it harder to get a softish landing?

I'd love to hear your thoughts.

The very first 5th control line mods were done as retrofits to existing canopies, the FOX among them.

Basically, the 5th line is going to compress your control stroke. If you are a short, fat guy (like me), you find that with a larger canopy (necessary to support my fat ass) the full control stroke is longer than your full arm stroke. It's obvious when this happens because either (a) when your arms are all the way up the lines are still tight and the canopy is not in full flight, or (b) you cannot fully stall the canopy with toggle input (and hence you're not getting the full flare), or (c) both of the above. If that applies to you, you may benefit from a 5th upper control line (be aware that your results may vary depending on where you attach it), which will shorten the toggle stroke and make it fully accessible to your arm length.

The 5th line also tends to make the flare "feel" stronger. Honestly, I think this is just a perception based on the difference when you add it (the flare happens sooner in the control stroke).

If you want to mess around with it, I'd recommend making some skydives on your new configuration and deciding if you like it. You can always just cut the new line off, and you're unlikely to ruin the canopy in the process.

hey tom, ive heard that you can not have very deep DBS's if you have a 5th CL because the canopy will back surge. i dont see why though. is this true?
thx

In my experience this is not the case.

I've seen backsurge resulting from overly deep brakes on a vented canopy. I've seen this on vented canopies with both 4 and 5 control lines.

I do think that adding a 5th control line will mean that you need to reset your brakes. This is, more or less, caused by the compression of the control stroke, since when you change the stall point relative to the end of the control line, you are also changing the stall point relative to the brake setting.

so your dbs would be need to be shallower adding the 5th line? any guestimation for how much?

I'd say yes, but I haven't actually tested DBS v. 5th upper control line.



No. I've never pulled the 5th line on and off and then checked DBS in each configuration.

do not get the 5th line on your fox. 5th lines are stupid.

they are also unnecessary. if you have short arms. shorten your excess brake lines.

I had an unvented fox with the 5th line on it once, it messed up the slider down openings. made them wavy and weird, not as crisp. the chute worked better once the 5th line was removed.

i believe that the vented canopies are working better with the 5th line. than the non vented ones.
you jump an unvented fox 225. that is a sweet canopy. leave it alone. that is as good as a base canopy gets.

your flares should not suck, you could either shorten brake lines, upsize, or just try coming in with your hands ALL the way as high as possible and then flaring ALL the way down as deep as possible.

uncle potatohead

I think that really depends on the trim of the canopy. Some canopies (Ace/Blackjack) were designed with a 5th upper control line for a reason. Some manufacturers offer the 5th upper control line as an option, again for a reason.



They are unnecessary for some jumpers, on some canopies, depending on the relationship between your arm length and your canopy size.

People with very large canopies for their arm length will find that shortening their toggle setting will leave them unable to achieve full flight, even with their arms all the way up.

It's very difficult to make a generalization about the desirability of a 5th upper control line (or almost any other canopy characteristic) that is universally true across all jumpers, all canopy sizes, and all canopy designs.

Perhaps they are "stupid" for you, on your gear. That does not make them a poor choice for all jumpers, on all gear.

Hi Guys......

Thanks for the input, it's an interesting one to chew over. I have ordered a BlackJack, which I'll use in some situations and keep the Fox for others (Higher stuff/cliffs maybe). I have heard other people complain quite loudly about the lack of flare on this (Fox) type of canopy. If it messes with the opening charcteristics, I'll not alter it as that was a big concern. Here in the UK, its omainly lower stuff, so the BJ will go in my old velcro rig.

Thanks again, and if you think of anything else, I'm always keeping an eye out.

J

One thing to keep in mind, is the Fox/Flik use a "traditional" 5th line attachment as opposed to the 5th line attachments on BJ's and Trolls.

With the 5th line mod on a Flik, if you take a delay over 2 seconds(slider-off), it will open so hard you won't be able to shit right for a week.

Yes, I'm being serious.

funny thing, pretty much all my jumps are on Trolls and Fliks with 5 lines, while they do fly different, I for sure have never felt a Flik slamming me harder then a Troll on a 2sec+ slider down. The both don't feel too good past 2 secs anyways...

cya

yeah i have done a handful of 3-4 sec slider downs with a flik with 5th line. and they didnt seem to slam me harder than my fox or mojo.

ssmoke on ???