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I was wondering how many fatalities there are in base jumping per year and how many people do it a year? And same thing for injuries. I am very interested in doing base jumping I just want to no how high the risks are. I am also interested in doing skigliding i can't wait to do that!!

About one per month; a little google research will turn up relatively complete data.


That is harder to answer.

http://basekjerag.com/...002B1F9?OpenDocument

This is statistic for Kjerag! Other places is hard to track!

I hope your also interesting in trying skydiving... While a couple of lunatics thinks skydiving isnt a prerequisite for Base, the majority here will tell you to get at least 200 skydives before even thinking of Base.

Add: Base ain't cool. http://www.splatula.com/bfl

...and sometimes even 500 jumps are not enough...

i really think skydive 'numbers' are the wrong way to look at it.

I know BASE jumpers that have 100 skydives and are BY FAR the most experienced, talented, and EASILY the most likely to survive their BASE career. I also know some people with 1000 skydives that i dont trust going jumping with me, for reasons of judgment AND skill.

i dont even think that skydive numbers are a 'norm' as in 'most good BASE jumpers have a thousand skydives'

not even close.

but skydives dont hurt.

on the nose.... great explanation. I wholeheartedly concur...

youre right, thats the reason why i sayed "sometimes"...

it all about the right attitude ..
but, take a look on the canopy skills during the heliboogie or on other spots and than you know what i mean...
i got aff students that got the talent to do a safe first base jump,...and i know people with 3000 skydives, when they would be at the same time one the objekt with me....i would run and hide...or change the valley...

there are to many youtube hotshots that got no clue what they are planning to do....they just want a "ticket to altitude" and go...

totaly agreed, i just think that the tie from skydives to BASE jump 'skill/experience/readiness/judgement' is slim.

I'd say the skills you learn from skydiving are really specific to "what happens after 6 seconds" and to control your wing if you really exercise it...

a more complete training would be like :

skydiving
tracking ***
canopy control **
meteo/aerology *
stable launch -

paragliding
tracking -
canopy control ***
meteo/aerology ***
stable launch -

platform diving / trampoline ...
tracking -
canopy control -
meteo/aerology -
stable launch ***

that is a really good list i think. well put together and thought out.

of course, you forgot the most important activity to improve your BASE skills.

-BASE jumping-
Tracking***
Canopy Control***
Meteorology**
Stable Launch**

It still is judgement and object dependant. Skydives help canopy control and increases skill. You can be a bonehead with 100 skydives or a bonehead with 1000 skydives.

If a person is not a bonehead and has 100 skydives, he is not going to have the same skill as a person with 1000 skydives that is also not a bonehead. Hopefully the 100 jump skydiving non-bonehead has enough judgement to stay away from objects that require a high level of skill to deal with until he has a high level of skill.

If that doesn't make sense, you're a bonehead.

of course!

but then there are natural BASE jumpers with 100~ skydives, and 600 BASE jumps that are much better than natural BASE jumpers with 3000 skydives and 100 BASE jumps.

its all different. its all about the naturals.

and im not one of them, sadly.

but whatev.

i kinda like how the '200 skydives requirement' is keeping some people from the sport.

Exactly!

A person should be really focused and intent on pursuing BASE. It took me best part of 18 months to learn to hang glide due to the rubbish British weather and my inability to train outside of weekends. I'm sure a requirement of a mere 200 skydives would be little to ask of someone who really wanted to become a BASE jumper.

I feel not only being involved longer in skydiving helps with certain skills it also means you are exposed longer to the sport and will no doubt see people / friends break themselves or die. This to me is also important as it gives you a real grounding and respect of what carnage and fall out is about. This I feel is important to help build a respect for BASE and the dangers involved. Not being subjected to hurt friends or people smashing up in front of them or dying gives people a "happens to others" sense, and I am sure that nearly every single BASE jumper has had a friend get hurt and/or die, but not every skydiver has, especially if they have only been in the sport for a year.

My 0.0000000000000000000000000000002 worth.

MAC, I completely agree with you!!

PLUS maybe skydiving is enough of a rush
to fullfill the needs of a prospective Baser.

Trying BASE without trying Skydiving in my
opinion is like skipping beer and/or pot and
going straight to crystal meth or smack

whats Smack??

The Junk
Heroin
Horse
H

FYI: I've Never tried it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heroin

That's a nugget...

Right on Tim.

Strangely a lot of people with less than 200 skydives will claim to be the exception to the rule. Some are... and some are boneheads trying to cite fallacy in the rule. The question that I'm curious to ponder is what's the ratio of those with minimal skydives to bonehead number versus those with lots of skydives to bonehead number? Instinct tells me there is a significant difference in the two ratios.

-=Raistlin

But isn't the real question, how to judge when you or someone is ready/have enough experience to take the leap from skydiving to base jumping ?

just wanted to reply to this thread since i'm only a skydiver for now, not base jumping exp, but avid reader of all base jumping info for a long time.

a while ago it was up to you if you were ready. but BASE is kinda turning into skydiving.

so, now your totaly ready when you get 200 skydives and enough money.

good luck!

200 skydive with 120 minutes of freefall, ok then you can do a written exam to get your Base licence

That's for each individual to decide on their own. Ultimately it's a personal choice. However, if one wants to paricipate in the social aspects of the jumping community having others deem your experience sufficient is important. Public events have requirements based on jump numbers while individual communities in various locations may judge by different standards, which may or may not be based on your jump numbers.



I'm not sure what you mean by "awhlie ago". Can you please explain?

Each individual chooses when they're ready to jump, and no one accidently dons a rig and leaps forward from an exit point without the full commitment to the risks and experience. Some are just more realistic about those risks and what experience is necessary to succeed in the long run than others.

Some may choose to point to the fatality list or the potato bridge as evidence that newbies are perfectly justified in entering the sport with limited skydiving experience, neither the BFL nor the bridge are indicative of the injuries, arrests, and other life altering experiences that result from those who enter the sport prematurely.

It's also interesting that those who opt to enter the sport with limited skydiving experience argue with those with significant BASE experience about what does or does not prepare one for the sport. Who in that discussion has more information, knowledge and experience with regards to the topic at hand?

The other common argument made by those who choose to enter the sport with limited skydiving experience is that their proficiency in sport XYZ translates to BASE. As they draw parallels from their other sports to BASE they believe that increased skydiving experience would not provide additional benefit to the preparation. They believe there is a skill threshold to entering into BASE and they've surpassed the minimum and therefore do not additional training or preparation. Again, it's odd that they hold such confidence in the translation of skills into a sport they haven't yet begun.

Then again the sport tends to attract the rebellious type who aren't particularly skilled at listening to the way things should be done. It would seem more intellectually honest to proclaim that one is entering the sport with an insufficient number of skydives, is not well prepared, and is increasing their chances of permanent injury by getting into the sport early rather than to try to convince those who have been in the sport for awhile that someone doesn't need 200 skydives to be well prepared.

When someone wants something bad enough there is no limit for self-justification. If someone wants to jump badly enough they'll concoct some formula or story that justifies it, convince themselves of it, and no one, but no one, is going to talk them out of it. In their heart and mind they likely know the foolhardy nature of their endeavor but nonetheless passion of the heart overwhelms the intelligence of the brain and the classic tale of the human condition plays itself out. I'd like to think that said individual realizes the faulty nature of their logic and understands that what they're doing is extremely dangerous. Some do, and I've certainly met some who don't. But if you jump long enough eventually the earth will remind you, and no amount of pleading, storytelling, or crazy logic paths is going to negotiate your out of it. Hard objects are unmoving that way.


There are a lot of dead BASE jumpers who had lots of skydiving and BASE experience, and a lot more who are damaged and injured from the sport. The real question for would be jumpers is: Why do you think you won't be one of them?



-=Raistlin

by 'a while ago' i meant before FJCs would teach anyone with x number of skydives.

of course its your personal choice to start jumping. no one is agruing that.

im just saying that it used to (back in the day, a while ago, BFJC, before me, ) more, um, personal?, intimate? romantic? getting into base. i dont know the word.

but you know what im talking about.

   ...nonetheless, passion of the heart
overwhelms the intelligence of the brain

Nice way to put it man. Reminds me
me of my 1st tandem, 1st night jump,
and all 7 of my BASE jumps

Best.nugget.ever!

>>In reply to: a while ago it was up to you if you were ready. but BASE is kinda turning into skydiving.<<

>>>I'm not sure what you mean by "awhlie ago". Can you please explain?<<<

This wasn't directed to me, but let me take a shot at it . . .

Having a certain amount of skydives prior to BASE was never meant to become a BASE community standard, it was meant to be a BASE industry standard.

Personally, I agree with -=Raistlin, and think, while some amount of skydiving is required, basically people are ready when they feel ready.

In 1978 when Carl Boenish got us all interested in doing El Cap there was no BASE community. The people who BASE jumped at the time just naturally tended to be very experienced skydivers. The first time anyone wrote down a certain number of jumps and called it a rule, was when the cut-short three week legal season happened at El Cap in 1981. One of the rules in order to get a NPS permit was holding a USPA "D" license, and at that time that meant at least 200 skydives.

Prior to 1981 Phil Smith, who later became BASE number one, started jumping other objects besides El Cap simply because he lived in Texas and California was just too far away. He and Phil Mayfield, BASE 2, were scouting urban areas seeing what was jumpable, much like the BASE crews of today. Together, it can be argued, they formed the core beginnings the BASE community.

For the kind of jumping the two Phil's were doing, jumps that were the first to usually forgo the altitude for a reserve canopy, there was no talk of a pre-set number of jumps other than it was assumed you'd be an experienced jumper. The world, at large, wasn't beating down the BASE door like today so it wasn't much of an issue. Pure wuffos had no access to knowledge, gear, or any kind of assistance. Most, at the time, didn’t even know BASE jumping existed (ah, the good ol' days.) And in the skydiving community you were either ambivalent towards BASE, thought it was sort of cool, or you hated everything about it.

About this time Carl put his wife Jean Boenish off a building when she had something like 46 skydives. I believe she had just one prior bridge jump (New River.) There was no uproar in the still tiny BASE community, but there was some grumblings on the DZ. Carl got away with it because he was the Father of fixed object jumping, and on the DZ, he was still the current king of skydiving photographers.

After 1981 when Carl first introduced the BASE number award (and named the sport BASE jumping) everybody who BASE jumped wanted a number so we have a good record of early BASE progress. If you look at the graph over at http://www.basenumbers.org/ui.asp you can see the numbers issued stayed fairly constant from 1981 to about the year 2000. That's when the spike in BASE participation began. This co-insides with an acceptance of BASE in the skydiving community to where today most skydivers will say they want to someday make a BASE jump. Basically we were victims of our own success.

The origin of a set number of skydives prior to BASE jumping started with the first legitimate BASE manufacturers in the early 90s. Prior to this, there were a few people selling homemade BASE gear out of P.O. Boxes like Rich Stein and J.D. Walker, but then cam actual firms like Adam Filipino's Consolidated Rigging and Todd Shoebotham's T&T Rigging (which later became Basic Research and still later Apex BASE.) These are genuine, albeit small, companies with real assets to lose.

I was with Todd the night he decided to implement a certain number of skydives prior to selling someone BASE gear. Up until then Todd sold Velcro closed BASE rigs only to people he knew. Not because he was snobby, but because the BASE rig was just catching on and most BASE jumpers, at the time, were still using the same skydiving rig they used on the DZ. That night a fellow came to Todd's shop and bought a BASE rig, and after he'd gone, Todd said to me, "that was weird, other than his name, I don’t really know who the hell that was."

I soon started running the Todd's front office and doing all the phone sales. Todd had just bought a home, he had a couple kids, a long lease on a building, employees, and money invested in tooling and sewing machines. He quickly realized an angry set of parent's morning the death of a son or daughter on a BASE jump could easily wipe him out.

So he did two things, he set the number for purchasing BASE gear at 150 skydivers (in lieu of BASE experience) and he started the very first rudimentary BASE jump courses. These courses were more about how to operate the gear, and not full blown BASE courses like are available today, but Todd always explained, how to pack, how to inspect, and what to look out for.

So I was probably the first voice on the phone to ask people, "All right kid, so how many skydives ya got?" I had over 600 skydives before making my first BASE jump so I had no heartburn insisting others have at least 150. But times change and I don't hustle BASE gear anymore, so I take it on a case by case basis.

I also think, with unfettered access to the potato bridge, it would be possible to teach BASE from scratch. I taught first jump courses for over 25 years at the DZ and realistically speaking BASE jumping (at the potato bridge) is a whole lot simpler than a level one AFF. Of course not everyone could teach at that level, but it's certainly possible.

The larger and more important question is this - is it a responsible thing to do? I don't have the answer to that one . . .

Anyway, that's what I think he meant by "awhlie ago."

NickD
BASE 194

Nick,
Thanks for the explanation. It's always interesting to hear and see the history as to how the status quo came to be. Perhaps, someday, someone will write it all down in a book... maybe even sell said book too. ;-)

It's interesting to hear that FJCs have been around (assuming I read the timelines correctly) since the 90s. Depending on where in the 90s, one can conclude FJCs have been around for somewhere between 8-17 years at this stage in the game. If one considers the birth of the sport to be in 1978, the FJC has been around for a signficant portion of it.

-=Raistlin

I think the transition from sky-jumping and jumping the potato is much smaller than the gap from the potato to any other BASE jumping. And this gap from the potato to other BASE jumping is not recognized well enough by any mentors or courses and should be the real concern here. The potato is the gateway bridge to disaster!!!

How about

-Wind Tunnel-
subterminal body control****

also, after you get skydiving you get a chance to jump balloons and helicoptors, which also give you this valuable, often overlooked skill.

I personally think the required number of skydives should be 300, with the option of proving your shit at the DZ in Perrine if you think you have mastered these skills before the 300 jump mark.