Basejumper.com - archive

Since many NPS rangers waste tax dollars reading this forum while on the job, I believe this might be the best place to offer some cash to all the underpaid rangers out there.

I want a copy of the NPS's BASE Jumper Suspect List and I'm willing to pay $500 cash for it. Anonymous submissions are welcome and I can paypal you the money.

PS. Christmas is fast approaching - you could probably use the cash!!!

That's too funny!

I'm going to mail you a fake list and cash the dough!

Please send money to JoeRanger@nps.gov

They really got under your skin this time around, didn't they Jason?

I've never met a 'repelling' enthusiast. However, when it comes to persecuting BASE jumpers, the enthusiasm of some NPS rangers is doubtless quite repelling.

Actually, some rangers are OK. Most are not.

If we just stand around and wait for the NPS to allow us to jump, it's NEVER going to happen. I also think that we need to show the world what's really going on between rangers and jumpers. It's time we show how we are discriminated against and we need to tell everyone what we want in our LOUDEST voice.

Until earlier this year, I cooperated with NPS as much as possible. Then they stabbed me in the back with fee increases and million dollar insurance policies.

Even more ammo is available here

A very trusted source informed me that the NPS wants us out of Bridge Day more than ever. We are setting a precedent with each successful Bridge Day.

PS. I'm still waiting on my Yosemite permit response. It's been 4+ months.....

I have the jumper list actually.

Here it is:
Jason Bell
Jeff Christman
Jan Davis
Frank Gambalie
Katie Hansen
Larry Jackson
Susan Oatly
Chad Peabody(guilty as charged fuckers)
Mitch Reno
Rick Stanley
Jimmy Tyler
Michael Williams

Edit: Better add Dennis McGlynn and Eric Ryde.


It's not complete yet, but we're sure to add to it in one form or another. All the jumpers above have either died, been busted, or suffered abuse because of the NPS policy. The list will grow, all because of the NPS.

Bill Legg
John Hoover
and there was one other guy that BD, I think.

Are all of these people suspects or just confirmed jumpers? what about the rest of the crew from the protest jump? And Jan Davis is no longer a suspect. RIP.

Now Dex. be easy on the NPS. They are only Fighting Crime the only way they know how.
To run you down like the Dog & Public Enemy you are & With shaking hand on there Weapon to take your life if you cowardly attempt to escape prosecution. For that lapse of judgment you took when you got back from Iraq and BASE jumped off Public Property . They Deserve that small reward to High-Five each other and say.
"Good Job guys !" after the handcuffs are tightened around your wrists. For a Job Well Done. (you can't see me but) I am standing at attention and giving them a Salute.
I mean you really have to admire the dedication the NPS has for there perseverance & dedication to Jumpers as Well as (let's not forget the) Climbers alike. We should not forget those Climbers because they can be charged with Arial Delivery as well for even dropping down gear bags to the ground.
The energy it must take them to actually, Save You from Yourself. It is enough to boggle the mind of the average common citizens. You are obviously an Ameba in your personal, selfish and destructive needs when making that BASE jump after paying your fee-$$ to enter that piece of publicly owned dirt .You obviously are just an Idiot for questioning the NPS policy.
Paying to enter and jumping and landing a Parachute without ever actually leaving, is Delivery. You moron !
Never attempt to deliver your own living, breathing Body unharmed with a Parachute to publicly owned property you paid to enter.
Chad what you need to do is just quietly stand in line like everybody else and just do what your told to do without question.
.

resistance is futile

Jason,

You already have the list they probably work off. It's the Bridge Day Registration List . . .

Try walking out of the woods in Yosemite and getting questioned and your ID checked by a Ranger. He asks what are you doing and you say nothing. He asks, you weren't BASE jumping were you, and you say, no sir, what's BASE jumping?
Then he says, that's funny, according to our records you've been to 18 Bridge Days in West Virginia. As they are throwing you in the Yosemite dungeon you can scream you only go for the leaf peeping, but it won’t help . . .

NickD
BASE 194

This is why on every NP jump along with my survival kit, I carry a taser and A large, long range bottle of a particularly Horrible strain of Mace that will probably deter any of the USAs best NP crimefighting squads. They cant use their gun when they have 100,000 volts in them, and they cant shoot if they cant see.

Dont laugh like im kidding,
and dont tell me im backsliding.
lethal weapon this.

Edited to add-
....wait... are they really reading this?

Sorry, but I have never and will never give any list to the NPS. From 2002-2005, they've not received anything from me. Actually, I've argued for several years that the requirement to hand over the list be removed from the permit.

So, no, I do not have the list. But I would love to see it and hand it over to the appropriate media so the world can see the discrimination.

calvin19
..."and A large, long range bottle of a particularly Horrible strain of Mace."
,,,,,,,,,,,

I don't think that using Mase & getting that close in range to the NPS especially when there is more than on of them on you is wise.
I whole Heartedly endorse the carry & use of a decent Quality of Mase/pepper spray. If there is a chance of Dogs being used by anyone perusing you though.
It readily available, cheap and very compact to carry. An old trick. Just a little on the ground in your trail. then button-hook back to see if your being followed or keep putting some distance between you and them.
happy trails on Public lands................

also: .Dont laugh like im NOT kidding,
.

But your Honor, they're "Park rangers" (Liars thieves and child molesters)

yeah, so we need to outnumber them 3-1. at least. zooloads and all

We need to have an NPS BASE jumper/ranger. Then we can get all the inside info!!

So who's gonna take one for the team and become a ranger!?

Hey Jason, I believe in you and please count me in for that 2025 "mission". Never been busted and if I am still alive at that time I would be nothing but honored to be a part of it. NO REGRETS.....Cheers and say Hello to Jennifer the great. Sincerely, Paquita.

I mean you really have to admire the dedication the NPS has for there perseverance & dedication to Jumpers as Well as (let's not forget the) Climbers alike. We should not forget those Climbers because they can be charged with Arial Delivery as well for even dropping down gear bags to the ground.

-------------------------------------------------------

. . . . .he he. Yep.Climbers get just as fucked as jumpers. Years ago when I first started skydiving I actually had a park ranger in "the valley" harass me because of a USPA sticker. When I asked him why he pulled me over he sighted a "zero tolerance" policy on parachute related activities, and probable cause because of the sticker. Which I'm sure is bullshit, however I am no legal expert. When he searched my car and found no BASE/parachuting gear but rather tons of climbing gear and "paraphernalia" (ie. a pipe) he gave me a whole speech on the dirtbags and trouble makers "extreme sports people" (his term not mine) seem to attract. Nevermind the fact that my education and ability to use proper grammar far exceeded his.

. . .perhaps their list includes both climbers and BASE jumpers alike.

Cheers,

Bigwall

Climbers don't get as fucked as jumpers. Their sport is still legal on NPS land. They don't have to drop gear bags to climb.

Climbers don't get as fucked as jumpers. Their sport is still legal on NPS land.
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I agree with you about the legality issues regarding the NPS and climbers; from that standpoint climbers don't get as fucked as jumpers. My bad.

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They don't have to drop gear bags to climb.

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No but they may need to in a life saving situation.

Have you ever climbed a multi-day wall route? Have you ever had to retreat off an overhanging bigwall in a snow storm with 100 lb. haulbags? I'm presuming not. When this is the case, chucking bags may be the only thing possible for moving fast in a retreat situation and avoiding hypothermia. Not to mention if you're already several days up the wall.

I'm sure you know this and I don't know if you attempted to educate this NPS dirt bag. But climbers/jumpers come in many different shapes and forms and from a variety of backgrounds. Sure there is the occasional criminal type amoung us. But there is also the doctor, lawyer, engineer, tradesman, etc, etc etc. Skydiving and BASE jumping means different things to different people. Many of you out there are way more passionate about BASE jumping than I am. But that doesn't mean that I'm not interested in it, don't have fun doing it and possess reasonable knowledge, skill, and experience considering how short I've been skydiving and BASE jumping. So to have this NPS dirt bag stereo-typing all of us into one group just shows what an anus he/she really is.

It's just too bad that some people in society would prefer to judge others thinking that we must all walk to the same tune in life instead of taking people for who they are.

These qualities coexist peacefully. Let's just say that every doctor i met in our small BASE world went far beyond the call of duty

Face it, we are freaks. Instead of showing our true face, we need to work on a civilized mask

bsbd!

Yuri.

RIGHT ON BRO!

You might be able to ask the so called climbing ranger, sell out, ass hole Link in Yosemite...

Ahhhhh yes - LINK - his reputation precedes him. I have heard climbers and jumpers talk of him.
Is this the young man and Federal Employee that is loved by Climber and BASE jumper alike ???
Is he the one that I have heard about that will go out and remove Hardware & Climbers Ropes that he has determined have hung on the wall to long ? Even though they my be useful in future climbs or possible use for emergency aid or rescue ???
I heard that there is nothing that Tickles his Ass more. Than to sit on a climb and Waaaaak his Pud while waiting to see a BASE jumper exiting from a wall. Then radio down for reinforcement to move in make there big Crime Fighting bust.
Is it true that he even climbs with his holstered Hand Gun ?
.

http://www.supertopo.com/...1980&f=0&b=0 ...

Ahhh.... good. A face to go with my grudge.

"0 tolerance"?

I am confused, I thought it was only a matter of arial delivery. so as long as i dont USE my parachute/paraglider/aircraft to leave the ground, or return to it, then its ok.

I have heard stories of guys kiting paragliders getting busted,

So i cant even pack in the valley?

,,,,,,,,,,,

Hey, JJEXP. You would not know why this guy chooses to do what he does would you ?
I mean choosing to be over zealous in his duties as Dirt-Police of a Public Park. In prosecuting a BASE jumper who pays admission to be in it ?
I have had a couple friends over the years that were police officers that also BASE jumped. I am pretty sure they would probably turn a blind-eye to a BASE jump they saw as long as there was no militias or Vandalism involved in making the jump even though there my have been a no trespassing sign stepped over by a jumper on the way to exit.
They I am guessing recognizes prosecution of BASE jumping as a non-victim crime for Stealing Air. Unlike Ranger Link, who will run you down and hold you for prosecution for stepping of a cliff and landing a parachute on public property that the jumper has the right to be on .
.
Hey are you sure that (clicky) you posted to Ranger Link is him ???
That guy looks like his Mom got Hooked-Up with a Howler Monkey or something.
Even though it looks like the guy in the Pic. looks like he has two opposing thumbs. That can not be him because obviously Any Decent, Real human being would not Do what he is doing to BASE jumpers.
Also I would think the guy would get tired of Sucking the Public-Tit for a living As Dirt-Police and go for a Job that he seems to be more suited for.
Like how about - IRS Agent - Porta-Potty toilet superintendent or how about moving up in life to a Security guard for A Sperm Bank ?
Might be a Possibility of him getting fired from Security Guard. If the Sperm Bank finds out that he Drinks on the Job though
.

Actually, I was hoping you guys would notice his last post about being in mexico.... I didnt wanna just jump out and say the asshole is in mexico, lets jump the wall all we can while he's not there to catch us

 

,,,,,,,,,,

Most likely the bastard is in Mexico because he can't Warm his COLD Heart.
Busting BASE Jumpers, Oppressing Climbers or Ticketing anybody else in the public park in December.
HOPEFULLY there are some fine Mexican BASE Jumpers I know down there. That will read this and realize that He is now on there Local-Turf.
Then Track his Ass down Just Like He Would To Them For BASE Jumping in his Self-Appointed Domain..
Then Show him there Gracious Hospitality that he So Much Deserves.
.

NPS hires a lot of seasonal rangers in that park. Typically, there are about 1/3rd the number of rangers in winter as in summer.

Nice one Cornishe.

Read your response to Link. Beautiful. Fucking beautiful. I lauged my ass off when I read that.

Link is an asshole. Everything that comes out of that guy's mouth is like whip cream on shit. Especially when it comes to leaving ropes, haulbags, etc. "Sure it's okay if you come to Yosemite to do a wall, but if you fix pitches and leave gear for too long we'll take your stuff!!" And his treatment of BASE jumpers is silly. I mean c'mon. . . .you'd think the guy could turn a blind eye on someone jumping in the early morning hours when no one's around.

As much as I would love to see a NPS ranger Maced and Taser'd, I had 2 add this 4 others-

If a law enforcement officer is confronted with Pepper Spray / Mace / Tear Gas, they do have probable cause to shoot you. Most officers in training are required to experience the effects of Pepper Spray, so they know what to expect if hit.
Same goes 4 the Taser~

Best Of Luck Jason, go get'em!

 
Don't forget parachutes nylon might kill them.


If a law enforcement officer is confronted with Pepper Spray / Mace / Tear Gas, they do have probable cause to shoot you.

 

really?
it seems that overly zealous enforcement has angered many as well.

most officers admit to having discretionary authority. law enforcement prioritizes their efforts as they rarely have enough manpower to rigorously enforce EVERTHING.

some choose to issue warnings, while others will choose to issue citations. it helps to be polite, courteous, and respectful.

I'm betting some rangers find our continued acts as snubbing our noses at authority. and the lack of respect is something that will motivate authority figures.

still, if we could discover a more serious threat to the parks than BASE jumping, we could stop midnight meadow surveillance

I have.

 
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In Reply To
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


So who here has actually met link? or talked to him about jumpers?

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I have.

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-- Tom Aiello

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Me too, and the guy is very two faced. He tries to act like he's one of the climbers and equally that he is in full support access issues (ever been in camp 4 for one of his free coffee and danish lectures?), but make no mistake HE WILL cite you in an instant for something minor. I must admit, I have never spoken to him about BASE; I would like to hear his personal views sometime.

I'd like to shoot him in both kneecaps and leave him in bear country sometime.

Chad,

I think we understand why you feel that way, and most of the folks here tend to feel that you are justified.

Still, threats or discussions of physical violence aren't appropriate on this forum.

Thanks!

How about dip him in honey and leave him in bear country?

~J

Why not offer Link free tuition to a BASE course at the Perrine? Let's forget the prerequisite number of skydives for a second and just either let him audit the course w/o jumping or PCA him into the river. Either way he might come away with a greater appreciation for our sport... or might just be more educated in how to bust jumpers. Is this worth a try?

I'll try BASE in 2007 i guess(need more jumps). But I never realised that some rangers could behave like that! Especially when it comes to arrest rescuers! well. i don't have enough insight to come with comments, just wanted to tell you what popped up in my mind:

Phone prank! Use a phonebooth to ring them and say" Hi! I'm john Doe. there is some guys wearing really small backpacks with legstraps, going toward (some well known exit point)". Make sure that it's on the other side of the NP, so you can jump safely where there's no rangers ...or..you could just piss them off just saying that there is jumping going around, when there is not. Add some beers and a recorder and post it on the web

An effort along those lines is already underway.

I apologize. I'll use the honey.

 
This is the first time I've ever been on this site, so hi, nice to meet you all. I'm Link, the guy who (according to rumor) hates base jumpers and should work as a sperm bank security guard (instead of a climbing ranger in Yosemite).

First off, I'm only on this site because someone told me they'd heard nasty things about me on a base-jumper forum. Since I don't have anything to do with base jumping (and never have), this came as quite a surprise, so I thought I'd check it out. Low and behold, apparently I'm far better known to the base jumping community than I thought... somewhat odd since I've never had anything to do with the sport. Even more strange was the email (that showed up while I was writing this post) offering me a base jumping clinic.

I'll cut to the chase. Here's a few things to get on the record. Feel free to quote me, copy and paste me, whatever.

- I haven't ever base jumped, though I've been considering sky diving (gotta try it once).
- I haven't ever busted a base jumper.
- I haven't ever tipped off anyone else who's busted a base jumper (despite what you might have read elsewhere).
- I haven't ever been involved in a base jumping bust.
- I have never turned a blind eye to base jumpers or otherwise participated in an illegal jump (nor do I plan to).
- The only base jumps I have ever seen were on the same day Jan Davis died (yes, I was involved in the recovery).
- Yes, I have worked five summers as a seasonal climbing ranger for Yosemite's wilderness department (three as a back-country ranger before that).
- Technically speaking, my father is not, in fact, a howler monkey, though he will appreciate the compliment.

I came to Yosemite because I love this place, and I've stayed a seasonal peon ranger for eight years because I still love this place. My job has always revolved around wilderness ethics, education, and climbing; never base jumping. Since the personal attacks on this site are, well, personal... I thought I'd step up and say hi instead of hiding in the shadows like I've been accused of doing. Again, this is the first time I've ever been on this site and the first time I've known that the "base jumping community" cares (or even knows) that I exist.

As for my personal beliefs about base jumping, they're pretty simple. I'm amazed by some of the feats you pull off, and I wish you the best of luck in enjoying your sport safely. Do I want to try? I'm more passionate about other things at the moment. As for how these beliefs relate to my job in Yosemite... they don't. Base jumping is not currently allowed in the park, and that's got nothing to do with me. If you want to see base jumping legalized, launching illegally and saying you want to bust the climbing ranger's kneecaps is probably not the best route to take.

As for base jumpers as individuals, I've met some I respect and some I don't, just like climbers. Each of our communities is a mixed bunch, so I do my best to judge people individually. All I ask is that you do the same.

I don't plan on being a regular visitor on this forum, just thought I'd toss in my two cents for anyone who's interested.

As for the offer to check out a base jumping clinic... it's not out of the question... though I must say reading this thread makes me a bit more apprehensive about the idea.

Good luck with your adventures, and if you ever want to have a chat in person, swing by the sperm bank.
-Link

Rrrriiiiight........

Hey Link!

Thank you for your post! It’s nice to see a ranger adding to this discussion! As you can see from my posting name, I’m 21 years old and I am also very new to the BASE community. I started skydiving when I was 18 and started BASE jumping a little over a year ago. Most of the issues between BASE jumpers and NPS rangers started while I was in diapers and some before I was even born.

From seeing your picture somewhere and recalling past postings about you I believe that you are somewhere in your lower 30’s or younger? Am I correct? In your post, which I quoted below, you said your personal beliefs about BASE-jumping were “pretty simple.” Well…you really didn’t give any personal opinions about how you felt other than the legal status has nothing to do with you.

After reading your posting, I have this question for you: I would like to know your personal opinion on whether you think Backcountry Parachuting, not BASE, should be allowed within NPS lands. I say Backcountry Parachuting because BASE involves jumping from objects that are privately owned property. The BASE community does not desire to legalize jumping from buildings down the street. What we do desire is to have the same access to government owned lands that other citizens of this country are allowed. Being at the age you are, where you were not directly involved with many of the problems between Backcountry Parachutists and NPS rangers, I would like to know how you feel about us and the legal status to get an idea of the opinions of the younger generation of NPS rangers. And please, do elaborate on reasons you feel for or against it regardless to the fact that “the legal decision has nothing to do with you.”

Thank you Link!

David Coco

Instead of acting skeptical and publically announcing you want to do something to his kneecaps, I would much rather hear your side of the story and see you share what you think Link, in person, has done wrong to us.

I've heard some of the stories, but I don't have the sources to back them up. If you can share them, then Link is given a chance to give us his side of the story. We can then decide to call bullshit after that, but at least it'll make for a more civil conversation.

What I will ask is this; is this the first time in the history of BASE and the internet that a park official is posting on a BASE forum without hiding behind a secret identity? Regardless of whether or not Link is an asshole or a great guy (I simply don't know yet), I think it's a point in BASE history worth remembering.

January 16th 2006, the day the rangers started talking to the jumpers, or the day we retaliated by threatening their kneecaps?

With all due respect Chad, you knew full well what risks you were taking when you made that jump. It doesn't make it suck any less when you get busted, but we shouldn't complain to the NPS any more than we should complain to a building owner when we strike his building because of a 180.

I agree Jaap! This is a good day! Whether Link is a good guy or not, I think it is positive that he has posted. I do think it is unfortunate that his reason for posting was because of the threatening of his kneecaps talk, but either way I’m glad he posted.

I definitely think it is important to have a dialogue between jumpers and rangers. It’s just like in a relationship! Communication is the key to getting things done and making up after a fight. So lets stop fighting and get to the makeup sex! Figuratively speaking of course!!!!

Good to see a ranger finally post something on here, even if you are only part time. In case you didn't know, some jumpers have been busted in Yosemite via "climbers on the wall calling down to other rangers" and they're probably pointing the finger at you. That is why they are so emotional.

What I do know is that legal BASE jumping in National Parks goes far beyond you, me, Yosemite, Bridge Day, and this forum. The actions of jumpers on this forum aren't going to make a bit of difference when it comes to legal jumps in Yosemite. In my opinion, Congressional action and/or a lawsuit (or similar means) might change things. Wishing harm upon rangers in this forum is far less harmful than when Yosemite rangers denied medical assistance to an injured jumper until he divulged the name of his jumping partner.

Speaking of Yosemite, rangers seriously disrepected me when they sat on my permit request for nearly five months, then mailed back my check with no explanation. My Congressman is gonna love this one....

However, for Bridge Day this year the NPS wants my $1878 landing zone permit fee by June 1st. They aren't very quick to routinely say NO at Yosemite, but they'll gladly take my money EARLY for Bridge Day.
I'm just sorry that I wasted so many years of my life being nice to the NPS only to find out that I (we) were being backstabbed.

Who in their right mind would complain to a building owner about a 180 building strike? Regardless, I think some of us have forgotten (or never learned) the history of the NPS and BASE jumpers. It's been 25+ years of discrimination. Do you think a forum conversation with a part time ranger is gonna change anything? Maybe if we send Christmas cards to all the parks, they'll let us jump?

The NPS doesn't have to change a damn thing regarding parachuting laws. And things will be the same for the next 25 years unless we get SMARTER and find a way to stop the discrimination. Forget talking to rangers and start talking to your Congressman, Senators, or lawyer.

EDIT: Read the attachment for some basic history on NPS/Jumpers.

Nobody, that was precisely my point!


None of us argued that, but physical threats are not doing us any good either. They won't necessarily harm our cause, but it's still considered unpolite in most parts of the world.

The main point I was trying to make was beyond any issues between BASE jumpers and the NPS; it's about how human beings interact in a civil manner.

Maybe Link did something to deserve his kneecaps being blown to pieces -within somebody's justice system-, but without the accompanying justification such a remark in isolation serves nobody.

You know Jaap, I like you, but you have no idea what you're talking about.

I'm not interested in telling my side of the story, nor am I interested in entertaining any conversation with Link. None.

I'm not here to argue with anybody, and I don't feel the need to justify my opinions about this matter.

Until you experience a NPS bust, you really don't know. And save me the lecture about the risks and all that shit. You don't see me whining here. I don't care what you prefer.

I'm pretty sure I don't, but you're not giving me a chance to learn about it either.

How about this one?


Sounds kinda familiar?


That's too bad. Usually when people resort to physical threats they're not even given a chance to explain how they got to their opinion. We gave you one, and instead you resort to rhetoric.

I must admit, I'm surprised that Tom didn't remove your comment in the first place.

I apologize if my posts are pissing you of Chad. I really like and respect you too, and I certainly believe that having been busted you might have a different attitude towards NPS folks than most of us have. But I stand by my opinion that that is no excuse for an unjustified physical threat.

To reiterate; I'm not asking you to renounce the physical threat, I'm just interested in what experience in particular makes you feel Link deserves one.

When you realize how long the NPS has been absolutely screwing people over, then you will know where I'm coming from.


So you're now a part of some board that I'm supposed to testify before to prove my opinions hold weight?

No thanks. I don't feel that I need to justify my feelings on this matter. I'm done with it. I never asked for your approval.


Maybe its because even if the words seem harsh and inappropriate, they convey an opinion that's held close to heart by most jumpers who have been around longer than a couple years.

If the board is the general audience this forum is meant for, I suppose I could be considered a part of it. I won't use the word testify, but it is generally considered beneficial in discussions to substantiate opinion with fact.

In this case my ignorance and my unwillingness to take your word for it forces me to be skeptical towards the stance you're taking, unless you would take the time to provide some background.

Sorry Chad, the smoke from those rotating wind vents is fucking with my head. I'll shut up now...

Your example is a generalization about a group that people cannot choose to be part of or not, and in which membership is held regardless of personal choice or actions.

Chad is referring to specific experiences with individual people who have made actual choices and taken specific actions which have had a real impact on his life.

That's actually a pretty significant difference.


I suggest both of you guys table this discussion until tomorrow, and give yourselves a chance to chew it over in the privacy of your own heads before posting more of your thoughts here.

You might even consider just picking up the phone and talking it over a little.

I'm actually totally done with this discussion.

Yes, you are correct. But replace [] with NPS, 'conversation' with 'encounter' and the analogy becomes only marginally less ridiculous.


It is only a significant difference to the reader if he actually offered the background of his experiences. He hasn't done so, so his post in isolation remains similar to my analogy (given the suggested changes above following your observation on making a different generalization).

I guess I'm failing miserably at getting my point across here. I'm not argueing whether or not Chad is wrong. In fact, if the many stories and rumours I have heard about Link and other NPS people are true, I am even inclined to agree with him. But without a specific background, a single-handed public threat towards a single individual remains a less than ideal form of communication.

No, it doesn't. The analogy you made is a kind of generalization fallacy.

And Chad didn't make a threat, he made a wish.

Even without his experience, NPS has done more than enough to warrant an overflow of ill-feeling from the base community.

Link is quite the achiever--a single post by one NPS employee is enough to incite base jumpers to bicker among themselves.

You might want to keep in mind that no one ever got anywhere by sleeping with the enemy. Jason is right; it's going to take Congressional action or a lawsuit, and trying to worm your (used collectively) way just won't work, quite apart from the fact that even if it did, you (again used collectively) would always be subject to the whim of those in charge.

rl

(I guess my resolve to stay out of this forum isn't as strong as it ought to be, but this was worth taking another hit from Faber about his perception of my negativity.)

The original analogy (then I agree, but I already said that), or the updated one? Tell me that: "I really hate NPS people; they should all get their kneecaps blown out. But... I'm not interested in telling you why. Until you've experienced an encounter with somebody like that, you don't really know." doesn't sound a little silly.

But lest it still be considered too generic, let me make it even more specific; "I really hate Link; I'd like to get his kneecaps blown out. But... I'm not interested in telling you why. Until you've experienced an encounter with him, you don't really know."

That'll work well in front of a judge trying to understand your motivation for doing so...


Well, if we're going to argue semantics; my dictionary says: "An expression of an intention to inflict pain, injury, evil, or punishment." Saying one would: "...like to shoot [somebody] in both kneecaps..." sounds a lot like that to me.


But even when directed towards a specific park ranger whose involved in such injustice is unclear to the majority of the readers here? Or are we arguing that all park rangers are guilty simply by extension of their NPS membership, similar to how we consider all members of a criminal organization to be some part guilty?


Don't give him more credit than he deserves. I'm pretty sure that quickly I'm becoming the real dick in this whole discussion.


I'm not trying to get into Link's pants at all, sigh...

I'm trying to figure out what specifically Link has done to deserve a directed wish of ill-being. Is it a particular event or because he works for the NPS?

Jaap, maybe you should let it rest (as Tom previously requested). Chad obviously has his reasons and he doesn't need to justify anything.

Ok.

 
Glad to see some folks are psyched to talk, and my apologies to those who think my presence is a bummer. My only reason for joining the conversation was to address the rumors and criticisms that relate to me personally. I'm here as me, not as a representative of the park service.

Chad, sounds like you had a bad experience with some NPS rangers. I wasn't involved, and like I said in my previous post: I've never had anything to do with base jumping (at least until now). I completely understand if you don't want to have anything to do with me. No worries, I don't take it personally. That being said, for you to tell the world I'm a loser simply because I work for the National Park Service is on par with me disliking someone simply because they're a base jumper. I don't have anything against your sport, and I'll judge you for who you are, not for what stereotype you might fit into.

David, I honestly don't know enough about BASE jumping to have an opinion just yet, so what I said before is true: I'm impressed by some of the stunts you guys (and girls) pull off. That's pretty much it. As for whether of not it should be legal in Yosemite, there's obviously lots of baggage around the issue... everyone seems to be operating on stereotypes from years past... referencing incidents from before my time. I'd rather make up my own opinion based on the issues and people of today. Some of what I've read on this forum makes me think there's hope for BASE jumping to someday be condoned on public lands, and some of what I've read makes me think that possibility is a long way off.

I'm not here to open a big debate, and I don't plan on defending or criticizing the current NPS policy. As I've learned in the past, people have trouble separating what I say as an individual from what I say as representative of the National Park Service, so for now I'll just keep learning about your sport and reserve judgment on the "future of BASE jumping in Yosemite."

As for whether or not one conversation between a seasonal ranger and some base jumpers will make an ounce of difference in the long run... I'd like to think it could; you have to start somewhere. Regardless, at least it's interesting.

Cheers,
-Link

A question for anyone who knows:

- How many climbing rangers are on staff in Yosemite in the fall season?

A statement for Link:

- They're not stunts.

 
Lou,

My apologies, I meant nothing derogatory by the use of the word "stunt." Perhaps "feats" would be a better word, or just "jumps." As for the climbing ranger question, there are many rangers in Yosemite who climb, and many who are involved in climbing issues (rescue, education, enforcement, etc), but for the last handful of years I've been the only one who's job concentrates mainly on climbing issues. I guess that means I'm the only "climbing ranger," at least in semantically speaking. Also, just to clarify, I'm not in that position currently. I've always been a seasonal employee (summer only), though for the first time I'm staying in Yosemite this winter to do video production work for the park (nothing to do with climbing, base jumping, or law enforcement).

Cheers,
-Link