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I have heard of people doing a self assisted PCA from objects, but have never gotten the full scoop on how to actually do it.

does anyone know how to pull this one off?

-e

Do you mean a standard static line?

Try searching this forum for "static line" and see if that's what you're looking for. There are many ways to do it.

If that's not it, can you clarify what you mean?

say two guys want to do a low jump from just for time being, a bridge. there are only two jumpers, and the bridge is not high enough for a go and throw therefore being BOTH jumpers with need a PCA.

the first jumper can go PCA'ed by the second jumper, but the second jumper will need assistance from something other than a person. how is this set up? or, how is it set up if you dont want to leave gear, equipment behind?

-e

Do a forum seach for "static line" or "carry on static line". It's best to have someone show you in person, and practice from something high enough that screwing it up won't kill you.

I'll highjack this thread to ask about something related. I recently saw a video of a person jumping from the corner of a building. He had laid his pilotchute on the edge of the building behind him. He jumped, trailed the pilotchute for a bit and then opened fairly high.

What would be the reasons for doing this? I don't think it would open quicker than a traditional hand-held jump, would it? The potential risk is that there is never a snatch force, instead the drag slowly increases over time, increasing the chances of towing. The other danger seems that the pilotchute could hang up somewhere if the edge of the building has snatch points. All in all, I couldn't see why this type of jump would ever be preferable over a go-and-throw. Any ideas?

Thanks,

Jaap Suter

In theory, the PC could be inlated and at bridle stretch as it crosses the exit point, which is pretty good as far as hand held jumps go. So, they may have felt that the 'PC drag' would do them better than their handheld technique.

Personally, I think it's a stunt, rather than an actually useful technique.

But hey, why not just try it 5 or 6 times the next time you're down here. Then you can form an opinion as to whether it has some value between the static line and handheld options.

The snag potential thing sounds pretty grim, too.

makes sense. but once again, its just my mind running laps

I think where you might be getting a bit confused here. BASE gear does not use a D-bag.. the bridle and pilot chute is connected straight to the canopy. doing a static line wont leave any gear behind. Seen people just put a few wraps of masking tape on there bridle to the handrail and go for it.

i know base doesnt use a d bag.
i figured you would have to set something up to "static line" off the object. follow ?
yeah.

i like the tape idea.
would want to see someone else do it before i was lookin at the deck from the exit point with my bridle taped with masking tape to a pole on the top of a tower. ha

-e

Tape works great. 3 or 4 wraps through the top eye of the bridal and you're good to go.

Yeah or get your girlfriend to PCA you off.

 

And what works even better is military spec break-chord!! It's ultra-cheap and can easily be ordered by anyone. $65 US will get you 500 yards! Split it up between some buddies.

http://www.paragear.com/templates/parachutes.asp?group=33&level=2&parent=193

Paragear...under "Thread"(rigging) bottom of the page. Why use anything else?

use steering line with a finger trap loop at both ends.Pass 1 through the other around a railing to form a larks head or a slip not.Then take break cord(any base manufacture has it $1 per yard)and tie it a specific way through the bridal(either at end or a looped not you make closer to the pins or shrivel flap)then through the finger trap on the steering line.Search on blinc will show you how to tie the static line,or here.Hope this helps.

Masking tape tears far too easily. I'd really recommend against using it.

Electrical tape is a much better choice, if you are going the tape route.

If I understand the method you are describing, I'd say the big risk would be introducing slack into the lines. If you don't time that just right, I could see slack in the lines, which leads to all kinds of potential trouble.

Do a search on carry with you SL.

Here is my set up. On low stuff I PCA the jumpers and hook myself up.

just a question Tom.Being a teacher of Base should you not teach the proper way of doing a static line with the proper materials?ie;not tape ,but brake cord?

he wasnt teaching to use tape, but if you did use tape to use electrical over masking tape (which he advised against)

The other thing is that electrical tape doesn't change strength when wet. As I understand it......masking tape can increase in strength when it becomes wet!?

You also have to remember that electrical tape changes strength with temperature. Sub-zero it can become quite brittle.

Proper break cord avoids all these issues.

Sure.

I was trying to address a potentially dangerous mis-conception (that "tape" meant masking tape), not provide instruction on how to perform a static line jump.

why even say it that way.just tell a newby to use the proper materials,and technique.just tell them the right thing to do first. let them figure out there own bad habits later.

point made, but more than newbies post here. But I see where you are going. You are saying that "we" should tailor our responses for newbies.

In general I agree with you.

But in this case, I saw someone who was potentially going to do something fairly dangerous (tape off with masking tape), where a very simple piece of advice (grab the other roll of tape) could lead to a dramatically different outcome.

I am not saying that tape is a good way to static line. Nor am I saying that I'd recommend it. But I wouldn't recommend (for example), freefalling a 140' cliff, either. But if I saw someone on a 140' exit with a 32" PC, I'd still recommend that they upsize the PC.

I don't think it's as cut and dried as you are making it out. Remember that 2 other posters had already suggested tape, and the original poster had already expressed the misconception that masking tape was the tape to use. In this case, you can either stand by and say "if you're not using break cord, I'm not helping," or you can say something like "dude, if you're gonna use tape, at least use electrical tape." Why not try to help them avoid injury?

I understand.Thanks for clarifying.

 

Abbie, I think you may have said it all. I am sure a lot of the things I have done were "wrong"...

isn't it, there is more than one way to skin a "cornishe"

you are correct,but there is also the right materials for the job,and the wrong materials for the job.

 

It's not just on the BASE board! It's in real life too! I have it from a trustworthy source that Abbie walked down from a jump yesterday because the winds were too high!

What's wrong Abbie? Are you getting wise? What is the world coming too...

 
But in this case, I saw someone who was potentially going to do something fairly dangerous (tape off with masking tape), where a very simple piece of advice (grab the other roll of tape) could lead to a dramatically different outcome.

back to tom.
i was (and once again) in my sarcastic typing tone made a comment about masking tape.
i know electrical tape is the "right tape" to use, and trust me, you wont find me at an exit point taping my gear to the handrail without someone there who has done it first.

i dont want any injuries, and there is no way i would ACTUALLY tape up with masking tape.

SO.

back to static line jumps.
i like dexters little tool that he has created.

OH and i also agree that online tutorials on the board arent the way to fully explain someones ideas on how to technically pull off certain jumps. its just a reference on ideas and previous attemps at doing extreme stunts as you would.

i'm rambling, i gotta stop.
-e

It's also a great encouragement for the mentally challenged to buy a rig on Ebay and huck themselves from the wrong bridge. Based on a true story.

I think when there's a flood of bad advice being posted by people who are guessing at what works, someone who know the right way needs to step in and lay out a method that works.

1. Take a person who's never done a BASE jump.

2. Have that persone try some of the methods described in this thread.

There will be a mixed batch of outcomes from that scenario. If that person follows the instructions I posted, then they will probably survive.

Does anyone feel what I posted is more dangerous than any of the other methods presented in this thread?

 
Information is the underlying stand in Tom's post. Palliative information at that - information that assists the situation at hand as it is needed, and that people find useful. It's unrealistic to expect people to apply only textbook BASEjumping.

Jumpers will substitute whenever they have to. It's better to have people thinking for themselves "why" a particular substitute works or doesn't work rather than just having ppl parrot one particular doctrine given to them.

4 wraps of electrical tape through the eye of the bridle (in moderate to warm climates) works a treat for me. Place 2 wraps around the "anchor" first before commencing the 4 wraps.

Cya

g.

Certainly not me, and I apologize if my comments made it seem that way. However, I also think that simply stating the following would have sufficed:

"Using standard 80 pound breakcord is what most experienced base jumpers recommend. Find another jumper to demonstrate the technique to you. It's not hard once you know how to do it, but a simple rigging error can easily lead to a total or a hangup."

I mean, if we extend your line of reasoning, what is stopping us from posting complete rigging, packing and jumping manuals? Admittedly the information is already out there, scattered over manufacturer's manuals and forums, but it's quite different from a Base For Dummies book.

It's a grey area. The information on this forum is great. But there should be an entry-level barrier that can only be obtained through real life experience from FJCs or more traditional mentoring.

In my very fragile opinion, somebody that is going to take up base jumping ought to have heard the term static-line. Just as somebody who shows up for a hand-held jump at the Perrine ought to know that routing your bridle over your shoulder (tuck or velcro) is a good idea. If that sounds unrelated, PM me.

I can't believe that myself, of all people, is writing this. Arg...

Loved your post Chad!

When I just said it's best for ppl to be thinking for themselves I didn't take the newbie factor into account - of course they need it spelled out for them the right way the first time. They need to know what the benchmark is so that they are aware of what they are digressing from when making mod's or substituting.

Nice instructions Chad. - Thx.

g.

Maybe we ought to start a separate thread on that.

Personally, my take is that technical knowledge ought to be disseminated as widely as possible. The more the knowledge is written down, shared, talked about, posted on the internet, or whatever, the more chance that people will run into it, and that it will not be lost.

I'll try to continue this discussion, because I think it's interesting. Feel free to split the thread.

From your article on getting into base:


Do you still hold this opinion?

Would you be in favour of an online database of technical base information? What if the information in this manual is enough for any person to buy a rig on Ebay and do a jump? What is stopping them from skipping the FJC, skipping the locals, and hurting themselves on a local object?

The general public still believes that a total malfunction is the biggest risk in base. As soon as people realize the real risk is object strike, they'll think it's something they can control to a degree. Then the cat will be out of the bag.

Many people trust their own skill more than properly used and maintained gear. Case in point; backcountry skiing. Surely I'm a good enough skieer to avoid that avalanche...

I'm all for disseminating knowledge as widespread as possible, but I also think that lowering the barrier into base will hurt the sport in the long run.

Hiding information sounds too much like "security by obscurity" to me. These methods are not sustainable. A better alternative, I think, is to inform people as completely as possible. The real danger here is that someone might get hold of technical information but not be aware of the risks involved. Our goal should be not to hide the technical information, but to make information about the risks at least as easy to find as the technical stuff.


I think the general public isn't BASE jumping, not out of fear for some hypothetical scenario, but because when they even stand near the edge of a big drop, they are pissing themselves. For most people, this is a strong cue to back away from the edge.

Yeah, there will be a few people who get past that and make a jump without training. But we absolutely cannot take responsibility for protecting people from themselves. There are too many of "them" and too few of "us".

Michael

I disagree. I think western civilization has become bored enough to overcome its fear of heights. Just look at the success of bungee jumping and more recently the number of people deathcamped of the Potato into the water. This works because they realize a PCA jump reduces the chance of a total significantly.

Not getting a parachute out is what scares people. We tell them that's not their biggest problem and hell will break lose.


Don't get me wrong. I don't give a rat's ass about the person who's going to kill himself without any training whatsoever. I strongly believe in Darwinism.

However, I do care about objects that other people have worked hard for, as well as the image of our sport. The public won't make the distinction between an experienced jumper dying and a beginner killing himself. Both have equally disastrous concequences for the general perception towards our sport.

Edited to add: While I may not shed any tears over anybody who kills himself without training for it, that doesn't mean I won't try to help him if he asks for my advice.

>>The general public still believes that a total malfunction is the biggest risk in base.<<

The problem with manuals and such, is we are still very much guessing. We are a few generations away from getting BASE completely right. If we ever do. The accumulation of BASE jumping knowledge doesn't stop when anyone in particular starts jumping. We have way more ahead of us, then behind. The Ying supports the Yang in this sport. It's the reason I can have a fellow on my boat who's been BASE jumping for a year and he says something that makes me think, man, he's absolutely right, and I never even considered it that way.

No, BASE jumping is the kind of thing that's propelled ahead by those who say, "who says I can't" rather than those who say "I shouldn't." There's a terrible price to be paid for that kind of freedom, but it makes us who we are . . . I don't think we will ever be able to distill this thing we do into a handbook, and if we do, it won't be the thing that attracted us in the first place . . .

NickD
BASE 194