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Don't Give up the Ship, Boys . . .

It's coming up on four decades since the NPS went ballistic after Pelkey and Shubert first jumped El Capitan in 1966. When Andy Calistrate stopped issuing El Cap numbers in the early 90s the count is passing 700. Later in 1999 Chief Ranger Bob Andrews said BASE jumps in Yosemite Valley stood at 6,000. And I think its way more than that. The only reason we are on their radar screen is we keep on doing it . . .

While Jan's accident may have set the clock back to zero in the minds of younger Rangers, it should be remembered the real issue we are dealing with are human prejudices. On a basic level Rangers have the same mental block most humans have, a natural and genetic repulsion to falling now further reinforced by Jan's death. We are not only up against stubborn bureaucrats; we are fighting human nature itself. A quarter of a million spectators sometimes show up at Bridge Day not to buy funnel cakes, and not to celebrate our conquest of the air, it's because what we do is so unbelievable to them, so against their own ways, they simply have to see it with their own eyes. The day we finally win, will be a day something like Bridge Day 2050, the day nobody showed up to watch . . .

I can't find the page now, but I was looking at a NPS official website with facts and figures concerning El Capitan. In addition to the usual height and girth figures they included when it was first climbed and who did it. I stared at that for quite a while not understanding why, when it was first jumped, isn't there too.

I've been fortunate, and frustrated, to have had the privilege to be around long enough to see most of the changes that have effected BASE jumping. I see the sport at a crossroads now. We are standing at a fork in the road and which one we take is going to mightily effect our future for generations to come. Slowly, but surely we are starting to abandon a long held stance that we'd do what we wanted, where we wanted, whenever we wanted. Now, we are starting to slip into playing someone else's game and I just want to make sure we all realize it.

A case in point is the current posts concerning the big wall in Mexico and to a lesser extent the cave. Basically we've gotten away from a basic tenet of BASE that dictated it is always better to beg forgiveness than ask permission. While I run hot and cold on the value of legal sites in BASE, I must admit when I read Jay's pleadings to follow the rules, my first reaction is a basic BASE one. Fuck the Mexican Government. That once held by all sentiment, is now in danger of becoming a minority point of view. If I spend the money and organize my own clandestine trip to the cave right now, I not only risk the wrath of the Mexican government, I risk being ostracized by my brothers and sisters in the BASE community. And that is wrong on so many levels.

No one can stop us from jumping except ourselves, and too me it seems we are backing ourselves into that very corner. We worked hard in the 80s ridding BASE of skydiving ways and skydiving attitudes, but now they are creeping back in. While it may prolong the fight, we must decide something. Do we want BASE jumping accepted on their terms, or ours . . . Carl Boenish was fond of saying, "Happy are those who dream dreams, and are willing to pay the price to see them come true," not, "Happy are those who follow the rules . . ."

Rules and regulations are being accepted in BASE jumping nowadays as "normal" by jumpers when in reality following rules stifles our progress. We are giving up the freedom to "dream" in favor of temporary access. Think back to the early days of BASE gear development. The very thing that allows today's jumper a certain degree of safety wouldn't be available had there been rules. I watched Todd labor all day on something new in his loft and then later that night try it off some downtown building. Once satisfied he made it available to other BASE jumpers. Had he to convince some government agency it was viable first it may never have happened.

Look at skydiving itself. The modern version of that sport began when board out their minds WW II veterans just started showing up at small duster strips with surplus parachutes and jumped of their own volition. Now the sport is a big over-regulated commercial game of, "may I." The FAA has made new gear development so difficult and expensive nobody bothers anymore. The last major change in basic gear configuration occurred with Bill's Three-Ring and throw-out pilot chute, and that was in 1975. We went, in fairly short period of time, from "Masters of the Sky," to, "Sheep of the Dropzone." There is among us right now the new Todd Shoebotham, the new Mark Hewitt, and if we are really lucky a young BASE version of Bill Booth. Rules and regulations will only hinder them . . .

Our toughest times still remain ahead of us. And it will take BASE jumpers with the guts and foresight to give up the comfort of regulated short term access in favor of our future generations enjoying unfettered and unconditional access. I realize jumping the Flatiron Building downtown will never reach that stage, but cliff jumping anywhere in the world can, and it will, as long as we don't throw in the towel too soon. And more and more I see the towels flying more than we are . . .

"At once, struck by surprise that such freedom could be,
We leapt from our perch of security,
We fell and then glided back down to the ground,
The moment was brief and we made not a sound,
The landing was hard, but our spirits unbroken,
We remembered the freedom of which we heard spoken."

-------------- "Flight to Freedom" by Jean Boenish, BASE 3, 1981

We are, and always have been in a guerilla war for our birth right to fly.

Don’t give up the ship, boys . . .

NickD
BASE 194

nice.........

Very Nice Nick....I feel the same way... It's like someone telling you how and where to hike.....I completly understand... I think that to jump El Cap again will take alot of effort by alot of people and most of all.."some kind of bowing to rules" I know Nick ,that it is against principle, but there has to be a medium ground. After 9-11, things that we normaly took for granted will never be the same today. After Jan Davis, and i dont know the complete story....They surely would have said no. It's hard to blame them when you are trying to show something in one light and then you screw the pooch. It happened with the space shuttle,9-11, high rise construction the list goes on. It only take one tragedy to bring everything to a halt. My friend got stopped the other day cruising to slow and to close on government cut which is where the cruise ships dock in miami. They had a 50 cal mounted on the deck loaded and a guy actually standing behind it.... Things changed allot down here from something that happened over 2000 miles away and over 3 years ago. It goes to show you that we need to be aware of things far from home as well, as they will effect us also....

Nice post though Nick...... Sounds like you are feeling Good!....I'm glad.......

Chris

Fact: for any activity our society has an acceptable risk threshold. If the scope of accidents increases beyond this threshold, society stops perceiving it as a sport and starts considering it suicide.

Fact: the perceived risk of base jumping puts us in the suicide camp.

Fact: whenever an accident happens, somebody has to clean up the mess, tax-money is spend, and people are saddened.

Ergo: Society would rather prohibit us from jumping.

Not-a-fact and open for debate: the actual risk of base jumping is not determined, but undeniably higher than that of most other outdoor sports.

What I used to think: the fastest way to convince society that the actual risk is not as high as the perceived risk is through legal jumping and full exposure. This will certainly be faster than remaining clandestine and underground. The latter will just put us on a ticking time-bomb given the explosive growth of the sport.

My current opinion: the actual risk is not quite as far from the perceived risk as I originally hoped for. If climbing were as dangerous as base jumping, maybe the NPS would ban them too.

Here's a question to everybody; do you think society should protect people from themselves to a certain extend, by for example mandating seatbelts and wearing helmets on motorcycles?

I don't know what my answer to this question is, but I'm hoping somebody has thought about this and has good arguments either way.

So...What is the fatality rate of climbing? What is the fatality rate of Everest??? Thats got to be super high....compaired to the amount of people who try...

El Cap....How many base jumpers died there or where hurt badly verses climbers.....I would bet they have had more climbing incidents.....and again i could be totally wrong.


Its true...society calls climbers on Everest Adventures...And they call base jumpers leaping from Kjreag..completly nuts.....

Well you wouldnt get me climbing Everest....they are nuts if you ask me....

Just my opinion of the moment....

Nice post Japp......Chris

Every time somebody brings up the old "driving to the object is more dangerous than the jump" things erupt into a melee of "well, per hour..." vs. "well, per kilometer..." vs. "well, per outing...". If you're going to use the word "higher" or "greater" then you'd best quantify the things you're putting on either side of it.

If I might ask, though... I think you'll find the excercise neither entertaining nor productive. What are you hoping to get out of determining whether BASE is more risky than gardening, or climbing, or bull riding?

That's an interesting but very ironic point you bring up.

Climbing the Everest requires a government permit that can cost up to 70.000 US dollars (albeit up to seven people can share one permit).

So don't think that base jumping is the only thing being regulated. Climbers, mountaineers, skydivers, stockcar racers, and even your neighbour's hiking trips; they're all regulated in some way or another.

The fact is that we're living on a small planet with six billion people. We need ways to coexist in peace and sometimes regulation helps us and sometimes it works against us. Never stop trying to fix the deficiencies! I'm just not sure if a continued underground and clandestine movement is the best way to do it.

It sucks the cave is closed. It's because of the hard work that people like Basehoundsam and the Stavanger Base club put in that other sites in Mexico and Norway aren't closed yet. Thanks guys!

I'll take one month of legal jumping over year round illegal jumping. I take legal jumps between six and nine AM over year round illegal jumping. Your mileage may vary!

The argument that limiting legal dates or times will make some people jump in sub optimal conditions is moot. It is each jumpers responsibility to jump in perfect conditions and those not only include the weather but also the politics, the legalities, the bust-factor, the nesting periods of local birds and what the hell not. The trade-offs are yours and yours only.

That's exactly why I didn't state it as fact and said it was open for debate.

I do believe the exercise is productive though, if only because it is the question asked by the very people who will try to stop us from base jumping.

Surely you have thought about how dangerous base really is? Maybe not in comparison to other sports, but certainly in relation to some sort of safety point that you consider your absolute zero. Maybe lying in bed all day? It's a risk-reward thing.

Do you think mandatory seatbelt and helmet laws are a good thing or not? Any answer to this question will be strongly related to your opinions on base regulation.

$70,000 to go and kill yourself....see.......they are nuts....

As you say Japp, The more we fight the harder it becomes. I have a idea Nick, what if some people in base get togather and come up with a list of ideas or operating guidlines that we feel are accetable to the base community. We then write these up and submit them to the NPS and we instead call them rules , as this word they understand..

In every part of this planet, weather it be in the animal kingdom , gangland South Central, prison, or just our own lives, there are unwritten rules we abide by to survive. I think thats what japp is saying...Is it better to risk loosing everything the ones pioneered and died before us or do we do whatever it takes to preserve it and let it continue as i think they would....

Again , I have been known to be complety wrong...

Yeah, me too! On many occasions.

 

I wonder if Dexterbase, KMonster or anybody else that has ever been busted or hurt there agrees with you.

Besides, even if it's legal one month a year, that doesn't stop you making illegal jumps the rest of the year. Just try not to ruin it for the rest of the people.

Considering you were my partner in crime for a week, you should know that we're not 180 degrees at all.

nice thoughts nick and as ever they have an air of the total answer....well mate....now we have a crossroads that internally we have to llook at.....does the ethics culture turn us into these nanny state products you are talking about or is there a line in between....im pretty wasted now but that was the only thing that stuck out...another quick one...do you really care that much mate...in 40 years time we will be dead and BASE 1776 will be saying....look guys its really uncool to wingsuit the freedom tower in rush hour on memorial day.

There are basejumps and there are basejumps!

I've done the legal bridges, the legal cliffs and I love them like little brothers. Great stuff! A lot of fun. Legal jumps will always have a bed to kip on at my house should they be passing through the vacinity.

BUT, and this is no small but, they pale into insignificance against the full-on night-time ninja assaults. They weep at the feet of the stealth mission.

They're that funny hair-lipped bloke in gladiator, compared to the Russell Crowe Warrior - cowering and ashamed and without stature.

They're like a semi-lob-on, compared to the rigid; rampant; proud; masterful morning-wood. (girls might want to use their own analogy here).

In short, they're only half a basejump, a baaaa jump if you will; and like sheep they follow in the footsteps of others. They blaze no trails, they break no new ground.

Nick, fret ye not oh little one. There may be jumpers out there, bleating on about legal this and legal that, and ethics, and advanced ethics, and extended advanced ethics, and 'i want everyone to accept me for what i do and love me' , but as long as day turns to night (fade up heroic music); as long as things poke out the ground; as long as there are fools who do stooooopid things; the illegal jump, the 'up yours fella' sneaky one, won't be going anywhere fast.

To slightly alter Bob Hoskins' immortal line in The Long Good Friday:

"legal jumps......i shit em"

Let the FLAMES commence.

Amen!

oh one other thing...

FACT: if you're successful in campaigning for legal access (and i truly hope you are) it won't be achieved on YOUR terms. There will be rules and restrictions and provisos.

FACT: The authorities who agree to give you access will be just waiting for the first sign of a fuck-up, a rule break, a low pull, an injury, or even worse a fatality, to justify ceasing the access you worked hard to secure.

FACT: no matter how much you try, or how persuasive your arguements, you will never get 100% of all worldwide BASE jumpers to abide by your rules. Some people are in this to enjoy themselves, how they want, when they want, on their terms. The more you try to reel them in, the harder they will fight.


FACT: someone WILL break the rules and someone WILL get hurt. How many of either will the authorities tolerate, having arrived at this tender agreement with no shortage of animosity and prejudice.


The chances are you'll be back to page one before you know it.


I'm not against the battle for legal access to certain sites, but like Nick i wonder if the freedoms you waive will be worth the freedom you gain.

I agree with you that no one should be stopped jumping an illegal object.
But I also think that objects which can be jumped legally by following some rules should be jumped this way. People are making a lot of efforts to jump El Gigante or Kjareag legally. To do so, they have to set up some guidelines in order to calm down local authorities. If some one decides to give a f%ck about this and jump the site to his own liking, he risk’s to close down the site for a the jumpers who would like to jump it legally which goes into the same league (in my opinion) as day blazing a illegal object...

My 2 centavos

not having made a single BASE jump yet..... soon soon.. dreaming of canopies it is posts and attitudes like this that lead me to believe i have more fundamentally in common with BASE jumpers than 'modern' skydivers...

rule, regulate, stifle and choke... make every aspect 'safe' for the masses... and so lose the freedoms that make life worth living...

I will take a few of my freedoms away in exchange for keeping a mojority of really stupid people either away from me or at least instill that just because they are morons doesnt mean they can try to screw my life up....It only take a short trip to a unregulated country to make glad your freedoms come at a price. The price is rules...I am sorry, but without rules there is chaos...It's a fact. Weather unwritten or writen....there needs to be a natural balance...Freedoms are usally paid for at price ...


And then again, i have been know to be completly wrong...

(The origin of this is left as an exercise for the reader.)

George:
You know, this used to be a helluva good country. I can't understand what's gone wrong with it.

Billy:
Huh. Man, everybody got chicken, that's what happened, man. Hey, we can't even get into like, uh, second-rate hotel, I mean, a second-rate motel. You dig? They think we're gonna cut their throat or something, man. They're scared, man.

George:
Oh, they're not scared of you. They're scared of what you represent to 'em.

Billy:
Hey man. All we represent to them, man, is somebody needs a haircut.

George:
Oh no. What you represent to them is freedom.

Billy:
What the hell's wrong with freedom, man? That's what it's all about.

George:
Oh yeah, that's right, that's what it's all about, all right. But talkin' about it and bein' it - that's two different things. I mean, it's real hard to be free when you are bought and sold in the marketplace. 'Course, don't ever tell anybody that they're not free 'cause then they're gonna get real busy killin' and maimin' to prove to you that they are. Oh yeah, they're gonna talk to you, and talk to you, and talk to you about individual freedom, but they see a free individual, it's gonna scare 'em.

Billy:
Mmmm, well, that don't make 'em runnin' scared.

George:
No, it makes 'em dangerous.
~

George: Nik, nik, nik, nik, nik, nik, nik...swamp.

Your age is showin', dude. :)

But I guess that means mine is too.

The river flows, it flows to the sea
Wherever that river goes, that's where I want to be
Flow river flow, let your waters wash down
Take me from this road to some other town
All I wanted was to be free
And that's the way it turned out to be...

I found it....Here is the stat...

RISK: you CAN rate the risk of a series of individual acts. You need to develop a system of ratings and use a calibrated pool of people to make that rating realistic and fair when considering a range of acts. Compare the rock climbing difficulty rating system.

I believe that it is extremely difficult and unjust to give an overall rating of risk for an activity such as BASE jumping because there are too many variables to compare and the spread amongst individual members of the community is far too great. What do I mean by this?

Easiest to explain with examples.

Consider a highly skilled, yet conservative jumper who has a list of criteria that MUST be met at all times prior to a jump being executed.

Consider a very inexperienced, athletically challenged individual, who does not even know that lists of criteria exist, who has no concept of safety or learning or progression, who believes in immortality, who has a firm belief that "it can't happen to me", who emulates the actions of other people without thought, etc.

The risk factor between these individuals is immense. Both of these types of individuals DO exist within our beloved sport. And there are many people that exist between.

Consider the general public. They think that BASE jumping is dangerous. Why? Quite simply because they have no idea, they have not and will never try the sport, because the act of flight and falling scares them. Their "risk rating" is borne from fear and lack of knowledge.

Lets consider an inexperienced jumper. They also have limited knowledge. Their experience is tempered by all the recent additions to The List, especially of experienced jumpers. Contemporary jumpers are attempting much more diificult jumps much earlier in their jumping careers. They are more prone to accidents and injuries because of the wider range of skills that they are attempting in shorter time periods. All this leads them to beleive that it is dangerous. Perhaps danger and risk (perceived or real?) is what attracted them to the sport in the first place. They think it is dangerous.

Then you have people who are skilled and experienced at assessing risk. They are vary capable and systematic about saying yes or NO. They find a potential jump location and run it through certain criteria. It either meets the criteria or not. If it does not meet the criteria, its not a BASE jump, hence it does add to the overall risk of the sport. If it does meet the criteria, then it exists within the acceptable risk quotient of the jumper concerned. For that person, the risk of the sport has been defined.

If you choose to freefall a hill that has a 45 degree slope, guess what? If you choose to static line a bridge into water, guess what the outcome will be.

Finally, if someone tries a jump that is incredibly risky with minimal chance of survival, then you can't really call that a BASE jump and include it into the risk profile. It is just plain suicidal stupidity. Otherwise we'll have to start adding general suicides to that stats. After all they did jump from a bridge or building.

Regarding rules.

Although I have enjoyed sneaking around on BASE jumps in the past, nowadays, it is a much less palatable option. However, one of the main attractions of BASE jumping for me is the fact that I am totally responsible for my behaviours and actions. WIth the exception of a few public BASE events, once I stand on the exit point, I am the rule maker. I am totally responsible for my actions. And I take pride in the fact that I am capable and able to do this.

But we DO need rules. And unless we are striving for inclusion in the Darwin awards, each one of us probably does and should have a set of rules that we should abide by. I have been arguing this point for a long time and have been trying to push it in a former role as A BASE Association safety Officer. What do I mean by this?

The rules are simple. Self preservation, respect of self/sport/environment/other jumpers/society.

They are the BASE ethics!!!!

You can break these down a lot further into more detail. Self preservation can be broken down into: using appropriate equipment, undertaking the right/structured training program, building your skills & progressing sequentially, being realistic about your self assessment, combining the word AND ACTION of "NO" in your repertoire, etc.

Not following BASE ethics is not about freedom. Everytime someone does not follow the ethics, they are potentially robbing another person of their freedom. This is selfish.

Most people think of the laws of society when they think of freedom. Given that their are laws that range from extremely fair and reasonable all the way down to downright stupid, I don't care either way what people do in terms of laws. However, you must not adversely affect another persons life, their property, or the environment. You SHOULD consider the affect that your actions will have on other people and the environment. Imagine of sometime robs YOU of the opportunity of jumping a site or undertaking an acitivity that you truly love. They would be robbing you of your freedom. Don't do this to others.

THIS IS ALL ABOUT RESPECT. If you don't have a basic modicum of respect and ethics. you DO NOT have the right to exericise your right to freedom.

If a site is legal within certain time frames. Respect that. Do not blatantly thumb your nose up to the authorities by blazing away in their faces. Use more appropriate timings and behaviours. If you don't have the time to be ethical in this sport r.e. jump sites, the sport should not have the time for you!!!!

Stay Safe
Have Fun
Good Luck

Wow. There they are, my sentiments exactly - all wrapped up in one perfect post.

Gardner

I am glad that this train of thought exists....

What a great post.....Hit the Nail right on the head..it doent get any clearer than that....

You know why medicare pays for viagra for 80 year old men? Because the AARP is organized and that organization makes them powerful.

Want BASE to be legal? Get fucking organized. I've read this entire thread and not once were the efforts of the ABP mentioned.

What pisses me off about NPS policy is that it's blatantly discriminatory and arbitrary as hell, our parks are a public good, and it's the governments job to make sure that every American has equal access to them.

Sure, there are alot of BASE jumpers that worry that legal sites will force them to compromise on the illegal ones, but put it in perspective...is the prospect of legally jumping el Capitan gonna keep you from jumping that sweet antenna in your hometown, hell no.

Let's get organized people...I wanna jump that bitch.

http://www.backcountryparachutists.org/step1.php

Man, that was too easy. Two minutes and I faxed three letters to my local representatives! Pretty cool.

Everyone should do it. Tell your friends:

http://www.backcountryparachutists.org/step1.php

(Should this be stickied for a while?)

I think you'll find an official welcome announcement from the ABP very, very soon. A short story on the ABP is out in Skydiving Mag this month. The ABP has a very dedicated staff and now is the time to put 110% into expanding our access in National Parks.

With that being said, I don't think anyone will be "giving up the ship", especially since we're not even on the ship to begin with. Expanding legal sites will only help our sport. Hardcore bandit jumpers can always do their thing, but the majority enjoys jumping legal sites and we follow the minimal rules that are in place to preserve the site. If an illegal site is made legal with a few rules in place, is that not a good thing?

Anyone who is against legal sites/events and their minimal rules should be sure to avoid Kjerag, the Hole, the Swiss Valley, the Italian terminal wall, Malaysian building jumps, Mexican canyons, Bridge Day, the Go Fast Games, the Potato Bridge, and the list goes on. All these locations have a few rules in place. I can't understand why anyone would object to "not jumping from the rail" or "not jumping a Stiletto 120". The few rules we have are in place so that we can continue to jump responsibly for many years to come.

Keep in mind that I'm a BASE jumper as well. For the record, I don't like rules any more than the next guy. Actually, I probably hate rules more than most of you (I don't even give out my zip code to Radio Shack!).

ABP Silver Member #1

Looking forward to the day I can legally flick the big ones in the valley. Or the smaller ones on the big lake.
That day will come. Won't be any less sweet to me just cos I won't be risking arrest. Actually think it'll taste sweeter. Thanks to those working so hard.

Sabre 210 - the hard-on visuals will make it difficult for me to sleep for weeks.

Peace,
539.

Being Devil's advocate here for a second, what will the ABP's stance be on gear choices for National Parks? I imagine it will be something like: "Jump base specific gear, skydiving gear is not allowed."

However, what does that mean for the homebrew base manufacturer that has come up with a new invention he wants to try on a slider up jump?

I hope we can come up with a peer reviewed common-sense system where existing ABP members can vouch for other people's skills. This would include the trust that such a new invention would have been taken from easier objects and for skydives first.

What I'd really hate to see is a situation where a rigger has to take his rig for at least X skydives and at least Y jumps off the Potato bridge, that he needs to log all these jumps with ABP approval and that he needs to document a broad scale of weight- and strength-tests.

Hopefully my previous posts in this thread managed to express my support for having local rules. However, Nick's point about being able to have an idea in the morning, do some rigging in the afternoon, and then test-jumping at night is a great thing in our sport. Gear improvements may have slowed down a little the last few years, the last thing we need is a bureaucratic obstacle for the few enthusiastic basement riggers remaining.

You'll have to ask Executive Director, Gardner Sapp, on that one. Perhaps gear choices could be covered in depth when the official ABP announcement is made. But I don't know why anyone would have any problems with a manufacturer testing new gear or disallowing the use of skydiving gear.

I just received an email from an ABP member explaining that the ABP strives for a jumping model similar to what the climbing community uses. In short it means the ABP is about access only and not involved with gear. Among other things this has to do with liability issues that appear as soon as any sort of governing body starts regulating gear.

Hopefully said person will join us here and elaborate on my post and correct me where I am wrong.

Thanks,

Jaap Suter

Jason and friends.

I respect everything you're trying to achieve: You know I do. The freedom to jump from your National parks' cliffs is a hugely important right, as important as the freedom to climb them or even look at them. My only point being, it's so important that, legal or not, we should be exercising it regardless.

I hope when legal access is gained, it will be on terms which are more inclusive than exclusive. In otherwords, i hope you get to dine at the King's table and not be expected to scrabble for crumbs on the floor.

Mark A. - next time you place your nose upto the glass and inhale the bouquet, and you get fruit and nuts and "wood"....... think of me

PS. ABP bronze member......and i don't even live in your friccccing country. Good luck guys and gals.

I think Nick is right and it is best summed up by the Godfather:

"There's only one rule - there are no rules"
Pete Fielding

I couldn't agree more. Ethics yes - Rules no way.

BASE has been a sanctuary from rules for me for nearly two decades now and it will remain that way. If someone has a pet project for changing laws and attitudes in their region then that's fine by me. I truly admire that kind of pro-action and wish them all the best and I think that it's pretty wrong for someone to intentionally try and undermine that attempt BUT there is a difference between an intentional and malicious action & someone just going about their jumping business as normal.

As sabre210 mentioned you'll never get 100% of BASErs worldwide on side in any given subject and to think that ppl should change their ways just to suit someone's agenda is just plain ignorant and unrealistic. You don't need to be a MENSA member to know that bandit jumping will always continue. If one does not take this into account as factual when planning their project then they are wasting a valuable opportunity to put forward something workable.

It's best to acknowledge this fact and take it into account when lobbying the relevant Govt. bodies rather than blasting people for just doing what they've always been doing. As stated by me elsewhere - as long as someone acts in a way that's not slanderous, site-burning, misrepresentative (a lie), or malicious then it's fine by me - my ethics so to speak.

g.

Hey guys-

I rarely post in the BASE forum.. (for obvious reasons) but in my own right I personally like the sport of BASE a lot. I know a few BASE jumpers, and at one point I, myself, would enjoy getting into the sport...

but currently my biggest hold back from entering the sport (minus jump number, but i'm not worried about that, because i am going to have [hopefully] 500 by this thanksgiving) is not the risk, but the penalties of illegal activites. Jail, fines, fellony on record could ruin my ability to get a job in the feilds i am looking at getting into. I do not plan on jumping for 2 years (personal maturity thing.. ) but when i do, i do not want to develop a criminal record in the process.

I really think that as a whole, a community, leaders should emerge and develope regulation that wouldnt be out of the norm of sensibilty. It happens all the time.. if you take a first timer to Utah.. then obviosully people will speak. If you jump the bridge with skydiving gear (attempt too) people will speak.

A USPA style regulation would be EXTREMELY wrong in this sport of will and pure love of freedom, but to lagetimize the sport we need to develope basic platforms and help the community as a whole. A standard operating platform would not be bad for the sport.. It just needs to be headed by people that understand why BASE was and still exsists. And look past providing the indusrty with profits, DZs with more cash flow, and providing more intrsuctors more money..

I think that legal base is extremely important, because as the number of people getting caught rises so will stricter punishments. As it is, if your a college kid and get caught.. kiss the ability of being a teacher, a law enforcement offficer, or FBI good bye with the trespassing felony.

This is just an opinion, and understand its just that. I have never felt the freedom of jumping off of a fixed object, but one day, when everything is mentally, morrally, and personally right.. I intend too... but hopefully not at the cost of my future. I want to enjoy the sport freely, and legally, because thats what all other athletes get to do.. why should we not be able to earn that right.


-dave.

There are hundreds of legal options to experience the sport,so you can find out if you want to participate at a deeper level. Bridge Day, Twin Falls, Lysebotn...the list goes on, but those are the top three.

Dude.... You perfectly summed up my opinion, couldn't have said it better.

Yes! Thanks TB, for articulating those two points so well.

no need to curse. GEEZ.

Hi Jaap

Peer review would be wonderful, but. . . . . .

There are some intruders in the common sense gene pool.

Beaurocracy will quickly follow numerous "stupid" mistakes. We need to minimise the stupid mistakes somehow. Unfortunately, there are some people who are downright stupid. Most people are sensible.

Test jumping something totally new off an access sensitive site is just plain stupid & lazy. It should not even be a rule. It falls under common sense.

Test jumping new gear first up on a BASE jump is not test jumping either. Its a stunt jump. A test jump by definition involves systematic aquisition of meaningful data derived from a controlled experimental situation. It is NOT a single jump followed by "Woohoo, that worked!".

That's just my opinion.

p.s. I was in your part of the world 6 months ago. What an awesome place. I'll be back.

Thanks Tom!


Yes, we absolutely agree here.


I totally agree, and would always recommend common sense, science, skydives and jumps from easier and legal objects to be a riggers guide.

But there are different degrees of inventions, and some require more research then others. Imagine the scenario that somebody invents a new PC pouch for wingsuit purposes that will remove all worries about burbles and PC hesitations.

This person rigs it up in his basement and uses it succesfully on thirty skydives. He even uses it on his local terminal antenna a couple of times. Unfortunately he lives in North America and his only chance of testing it from a terminal cliff is by visiting a national park.

Preferably we can vouch for the quality of such an invention through a person's references and his explanation. I would imagine that even the newest rigger would at least have made some connections in the base community before using his sewing machine.

What I would hate to see is a governing body that wants full legalized documentation of his invention and logs of his testing approach before he is allowed to take this thing off a cliff. Such a requirement would instantly slow down the evolution of gear which, especially in the area of wingsuiting, is still running at high velocity.

From my discussions with ABP members I learned they have no desire to become or install such a governing body. They only want to gain access. Beyond that, common sense should be our guide the same way it works in the climbing scene. And as you explain yourself, if somebody wants to take a radically new invention off a cliff for its first test, it is no longer a base jump but really more of a stunt. It falls outside our domain.

The same thing goes for somebody doing his first cliff jump without preparation, e.g. insufficient skydives and no jumps from more forgiving objects. It would fall outside our domain and we can only try and avoid these kind of incidents through education and dissemination of our history.

Unfortunately, the NPS might not be so understanding when it comes to incidents related to use of improper gear or insufficient preparation. The climbing community has set precedents in our favour though. On several occasions ill-prepared climbers have needed costly rescue operations. Some of these groups were fined for recklesness and generally considered far from representative for the climbing community.

One member of the ABP has mentioned that we have a lot more in common with the climbing community than with the USPA and FAA controlled sport of skydiving. I couldn't agree more. While our physical preparation might come from our skydives, the base community could learn a lot from the ethics and guidelines that climbers live by. The second we venture into the backcountry we need to realize that we have left the dropzone. We enter hostile territory that we share with nature as well as with other people who also want to enjoy its beauty.


You mean British Columbia right? I was born in the Netherlands which is great too, but not nearly as good as where I live these days. I still need to pinch myself when I wake up every morning. I am very grateful I'm able to live here.

Definitely drop me a note when you're visiting again. Although that goes for any visitor who reads this. It's always a pleasure to show off our beautiful city and its surroundings.

Yep - I hate excessive rules too. But there will always be stupid people who create controversy and there will always be beaurocracts who want to outlaw activities that they consider inappropriate. The result is often banning. There must be a way of keeping the stupid people out of sight of those beaurocrats. Perhaps the steal & bury" technique?? Just joking.

r.e. the testing of advancing technologies and techniques, its ironic that you mention wingsuits. My avatar picture fully backs your philosophy of allowing people to develop equipment and then test it. I built that suit before Birdman existed and my colleague in the photo was paving the way in BASE skysurfing. Seems that you have LOTS in common with that photo. We both tested from a plane first. Everyone has this option. There are many very intelligent people in this sport (not me ). It is great when they contribute in the various areas:
- technique
- equipment
- access
- promotion
- site research
- etc

Yes, British Columbia & Alberta. MAGNIFICENT. Even just a drive up the Icefields parkway would pump adrenalin through the veins of ANY human being.