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You can see in the video that i had a fair bit of horizontal distance to use...

but without the necessary brake adjustment. This would have affected the response time required, basically putting the jumper into the cliff in less time.

Glad you are still alive......that looked horrible

Is there anything else you can do after a strike to improve the odds a bit (Control Input).....or simply wait to slide onto a ledge?


Bit too wet for you today ehh Faber ???

...got on toggles straight away to turn right, couldn't feel my canopy turning after a couple of seconds and by that time had been rag-dolled around to the left and that looked like the better option, so i tried to turn left but was pretty much on the cliff and ended up flaring straight at it.....

Yeah, i went for toggles. That's what i was taught and felt comfortable with. I also think this has to do with the learning environment in Oz (others might not agree), where your first x number of jumps are sub-200ft PCA's, i had developed a riser response while skydiving but forgot about that on my first jumps as you've gotta be on toggles pretty quickly to land.

In case of imminent strike, use the risers. Otherwise use the toggles

Why...?
Or rather.... whats the advantage of this methodology over just using risers to turn yourself away from a 'non' imminent strike?

That wasn't very clear, was it? Sorry. I'll try to clean it up and explain better if you want.

Rather than change grips to 'go to toggles' on a 180 where the object has been avoided through rear riser input.........is it not better to just ease off the amount of rear riser input and still continue the turn until the desired heading is reached....
Or is the altitude loss between riser/toggle turn that different?

Yeah i climbed down about 50 feet then there was another 50 feet of unclimbable rock down to a ledge that was accessible from the landing area. I sat there for 3 hours while the guy i was jumping with organised some ropes and stuff to get down with (thanks ben!). I was stuck on the face for 4 1/2 hours all up. It ended up being quite fun, after a failed attempt to throw up a rock with some fishing line tied to it, i had to make a rope out of my clothes which came up short, so i made the rest with some bark from a small shrub on the ledge i was on. How not to BASE jump macguyver style...

...how in the hell did you get off that ledge?

extra tailgates, diff sized rubber bands, pullup cords, knife, wind meter, closing loops, a small bunch of break cord. 2 links with 2 ft of cord already tied, a small flashlight, gloves unless worn, lighter, DV cable, and a radio if needed for the jump.

Or you can pop your brakes and instantly continue into half brakes (basically using up the line that has been released), then sink it in and flare from half brakes. Resulting in minimal surge and a flare. Common when free falling the sub 200" "S" that was talked about earlier in this thread.

It's probably better to pop the toggles to a point well past half brakes. From deep brakes to half brakes will still cause a surge. You ought to be bringing the toggles to the same point as the brakes held them (i.e. to deep brakes), to avoid the surging (into the ground, object, etc). Then let up slowly and flare from where ever the toggles are when you get to the ground.

Bit too wet for you today ehh Faber ???

To simplify:

Toggle turns use more forward space.

...got on toggles straight away to turn right, couldn't feel my canopy turning after a couple of seconds and by that time had been rag-dolled around to the left and that looked like the better option, so i tried to turn left but was pretty much on the cliff and ended up flaring straight at it.....

Yeah, i went for toggles. That's what i was taught and felt comfortable with. I also think this has to do with the learning environment in Oz (others might not agree), where your first x number of jumps are sub-200ft PCA's, i had developed a riser response while skydiving but forgot about that on my first jumps as you've gotta be on toggles pretty quickly to land.

Saying that, i will definitely go for risers in the future. You can see in the video that i had a fair bit of horizontal distance to use, which i ate up by not responding appropriately (turning left first). I think if i left the brakes stowed and went for risers i would have had enough horizontal distance for the second response.

OK, this has saved my ass on about 4 occurrences with Mojo's:

180 offheading - flying at wall - very close to impact. No time to turn away. Hard input on both rear risers. Canopy stalls backwards. Let up on left rear riser (while still pulling down on right). Canopy barely turns - cells are barely pressurized and there are waves going through the canopy. Reach across with left hand and pull down on front right riser (while still pulling down on right rear riser). This forces air into the cells - canopy instantly response and spins on the spot. Immediately let up on riser input and release brakes to drive away from the wall.

My importance list for avoiding a wall strike:

1. 180’s happen to all of us eventually. Do every thing you can to minimize the occurrence but resign yourself to the fact that they will happen. (Note: see the definition of Murphy’s Law).

2. Avoid smacking the wall at ALL costs.
Get the canopy to open with absolute MINIMAL forward speed. Forget all that sh*t about needing forward speed to get the canopy to respond to riser input. There is zero point to having a responsive canopy if you don't have the time to turn it away. Also the faster the forward speed of your canopy on deployment the harder you will hit the wall and the more bones will snap.
SLOWER forward speed is BETTER in 99% of serious offheadings close to the wall. Anyone who tells you otherwise has not had to deal with a bona fida 180, half line twists on a go-n-throw from a vertical wall. Factory installed brake settings on Mojo's are dangerous, dangerous, dangerous - even for the fastest BASE jumper in the world. Yeah - they work great for rear riser input on a 135 offheading, but turn it into a 160-180 offheading and the wall comes at you like a freight train. (Note: Adam does strongly recommend customizing your brake settings as the factory settings are extremely conservative. This is more of an issue with Mojo's than with FOX's due to the steep angle of attack on the Mojo).

3. Turn the canopy away from the wall.
In dealing with point #2 you have installed customized brake settings on your canopy (but not so deep that you risk a stall). Now because the canopy is going so slow you suddenly have response issues to rear riser input. Basically the thing won't want to turn and will probably stall if you pull down too hard on a rear riser.
The answer to this is not: make the canopy fly faster forward (read point #2 again). The answer is do something else to make the canopy turn away. Some people say "toggles". Well toggles are great (and my personal preference) if you aren't really close to the wall and flying directly at it. There are situations (eg. go-n-throw from vertical wall, bona fida 180 with half a line twist) where you do not have time to use toggles (I am NOT talking about the extra time to grab the toggles, I am talking about the response lag between releasing the brakes, pulling down on the toggle and the canopy actually responding). Also you may be so close to the wall that as you are turning away the end cell will drag on the wall and swing you back in. (I have seen this type of wall strike many times - and subsequently dealt many times with the resulting helicopter rescue, police, media, blah blah blah). If you are about to smack a wall nose on, the only thing to do is to back the canopy away far enough so that when you turn it, the end cell won't clip the wall. Flying the canopy backwards is the only option here (unless you are so low that you will pound into a ledge or the ground as you turn - in that case you just have to sink the canopy straight down and PLF - good luck).
In order to turn the canopy away the combination of both front and rear riser (with the brakes set) works really well. The canopy response almost instantly and just spins on the spot. Front riser input alone is a BAD idea as it makes the canopy dive forward and turn in an arc.

Note: In my experiences with the Vtec (and limited experience with the Blackjack) you usually don't need the front riser input as the vents keep the cells pressurized in almost zero forward speed and the canopy response great to rear riser input alone.

When to go for toggles and when to go for risers?
Basically here is my personal rule for that: If I open and I am flying at a wall and my body starts tensing up for immanent impact then I go for risers, otherwise I tend to go for toggles.
“Oh sh*t, whimper" on opening = risers.
"Uh Oh, I'm looking at wall" = toggles.

4. You aren’t good enough with the technology you are using to always avoid object strike.
With the current technology on the market NOBODY is good enough to avoid a wall strike every time. I have dealt with bad 180's close to the wall (sometimes with serious line twists) on many occasions (actually the number of times I have had 180's is downright embarrassing). I have never had my canopy touch the wall yet (I've pushed of the wall with my feet twice), but I am NOT stupid enough to think that I am good enough to deal with it every time.
Object strike is the number one incident that injuries highly experienced BASE jumpers when they haven't made a gross error of judgment. By plugging out thousands of BASE jumps we are playing a numbers game (if you jump vertical walls slider down). Statistics say that eventually you will hit the wall (Slim hit the wall three times in 1270 BASE jumps. Jump #1270 was the one that really f####d him up (but he's healing well and should be jumping next year). He probably has done the most slider down canopy deployments of anyone in the world and he is ULTRA FAST in dealing with offheadings). As the technology we are using advances (such as bottom skin vents, big grab toggles, vented pilot chutes) the odds are increased in our favor. All we can hope is that the technology increases at a faster rate than the numbers game we are playing.

Hope this helps.

When to go for toggles and when to go for risers?
Basically here is my personal rule for that: If I open and I am flying at a wall and my body starts tensing up for imminent impact then I go for risers, otherwise I tend to go for toggles. (emphasis added)

I am curious how you reconcile this conflict between what you said his position was, and what he stated as his position.
Can you clarify?

Johnny,

I found it interesting that in your article you cite Dwain as an authority supporting your position, based on a conversation you had with him in 1999.

Dwain and I are on the same page, like we were on most things we discussed. I can think of a time when we disagreed on an issue. It was at the last Petronas event, concerning a jumper who spiraled onto the roof of the mall. After watching the video one time, I said it looked like he had a tension knot. Both Dwain and Slim adamantly disagreed with me. They thought because the slider had come down, it could not be a tension knot. I listen to their response, and quickly determined that a tension knot can occur within a single risers line set. After explaining this to them, they still disagreed. Later that day, a zoomed in photograph, taken from another building, showed without a doubt, that it was indeed what I said it was (a tension knot).

This reminds me of something you said at Petronas last December. You were saying that a line over will not make your canopy spiral. I over heard this and thought for the safety of you and others, I should inquire. I asked you why you would think that. You said because you had a line over and it did not spiral. I told you then, Every line over has a different configuration. I hope you believe that.

180 offheading - flying at wall - very close to impact. No time to turn away. Hard input on both rear risers. Canopy stalls backwards. Let up on left rear riser (while still pulling down on right). Canopy barely turns - cells are barely pressurized and there are waves going through the canopy. Reach across with left hand and pull down on front right riser (while still pulling down on right rear riser). This forces air into the cells - canopy instantly response and spins on the spot. Immediately let up on riser input and release brakes to drive away from the wall.

SLOWER forward speed is BETTER in 99% of serious offheadings close to the wall. Anyone who tells you otherwise has not had to deal with a bona fida 180, half line twists on a go-n-throw from a vertical wall.

Some people say "toggles". Well toggles are great (and my personal preference) if you aren't really close to the wall and flying directly at it.

There are situations (eg. go-n-throw from vertical wall, bona fida 180 with half a line twist) where you do not have time to use toggles (I am NOT talking about the extra time to grab the toggles, I am talking about the response lag between releasing the brakes, pulling down on the toggle and the canopy actually responding).

Also you may be so close to the wall that as you are turning away the end cell will drag on the wall and swing you back in.

If you are about to smack a wall nose on, the only thing to do is to back the canopy away far enough so that when you turn it, the end cell won't clip the wall. Flying the canopy backwards is the only option here (unless you are so low that you will pound into a ledge or the ground as you turn - in that case you just have to sink the canopy straight down and PLF - good luck).

When to go for toggles and when to go for risers?
Basically here is my personal rule for that: If I open and I am flying at a wall and my body starts tensing up for immanent impact then I go for risers, otherwise I tend to go for toggles.
“Oh sh*t, whimper" on opening = risers.
"Uh Oh, I'm looking at wall" = toggles.

Yeah - they(conservative brake settings) work great for rear riser input on a 135 offheading, but turn it into a 160-180 offheading and the wall comes at you like a freight train.

In dealing with point #2 you have installed customized brake settings on your canopy (but not so deep that you risk a stall). Now because the canopy is going so slow you suddenly have response issues to rear riser input. Basically the thing won't want to turn and will probably stall if you pull down too hard on a rear riser.

What I'd really like to see are these techniques in action. (Risers and Toggles) Having someone shoot video from the top, of both techniques with the same canopy. If I lived closer to the bridge I would do it myself.

set up a camera on the edge of a bridge facing straight down. jump off facing the bridge.. try the 2 methods of turning as soon as canopy opens. see which method puts you more under the bridge..

Another possibility is to do both techniques, as well as Dwain's front/rear riser turn